Israel and Palestine

[gwprod12]

I'm absolutely 100% baffled by this.

 

You're saying that when the hebrew kept slaves, they were merely "servants"? Not owned property?

 

I think what you're trying to justify is that slavery is perfectly okay, as long as it's someone else, and not you.

 

There is historical evidence that the hebrews kept slaves. There is no historical evidence that supports the story of Exodus.

[yossicl]

I'm absolutely 100% baffled by this.

 

You're saying that when the hebrew kept slaves, they were merely "servants"? Not owned property?

 

I think what you're trying to justify is that slavery is perfectly okay, as long as it's someone else, and not you.

 

There is historical evidence that the hebrews kept slaves. There is no historical evidence that supports the story of Exodus.

Yes, not owned property (you can read it in the bible).

There was even Hebrew "Slaves" to Hebrew "master".

About historical evidence... Well, there is no historical evidence that God exist... So...

There a lot of thing on non historical evidence like the human came from the monkey...

[gwprod12]

Either slaves are slaves, or they arent. How can the Hebrews be the slaves of the Egyptians (as owned property) when slavery means "employee" for the Hebrews?

 

"There a lot of thing on non historical evidence like the human came from the monkey..."

 

It saddens me that people who think evolution is wrong havent the faintest grasp about what it's talking about. Monkeys didnt turn into Human beings.

[yossicl]

Either slaves are slaves, or they arent. How can the Hebrews be the slaves of the Egyptians (as owned property) when slavery means "employee" for the Hebrews?

 

"There a lot of thing on non historical evidence like the human came from the monkey..."

 

It saddens me that people who think evolution is wrong havent the faintest grasp about what it's talking about. Monkeys didnt turn into Human beings.

.... "When the Hebrew people forced to working under Egyptian ruler they have no society condition or any kind of privileging".

Btw,

I’m slave to my boss to IRS to my house mortgage to my kids and to my wife.

[killbot1000]

about downloading music, I really dont see that as wrong, I download songs, and movies, and tv shows, if i like them, I buy them, if i dont like them, or dont like them enough, I dont buy them, the actual movie only costs a total of 5 dollars to make, so why is it wrong for me to not want to pay 20 dollars for it? If its really good, its worth 20, but not in any other situation, its not really stealing, since its not really a physical object, its just copyright infringment, and if i like it and I buy it, who cares? I know this is a bit off subject, but I felt I had to address it...

[u1m2]

I take serious offense. If you believe that nobody would be interested in converting to the Jewish faith, fine. Give me an argument as to why it is undesirable, and everyone will be able to see that you are competent, not just following what propaganda has told you.

 

 

All monotheist religions that came after judaism is more refined and sophisticated compared to judaism. There is no point for a Muslim or Christian to convert to judaism as it would be just like downgrading your firmware. There is nothing uncovered in Quran that is being thought in the jewish religion, on the contrary, Quran is significantly more comprehensive in matters of life and beyond. The whole slavery issue is just another proof to this which can be understood in Prophet Muhammed's opinion on slavery

 

Once Abu Masud Ansari was beating his slave when he heard a voice behind him say, "Abu Masud! Allah has more power and control over you than you have over this slave." Abu Masud turned and saw that it was Allah's Messenger. He said, "O Allah's Messenger! I free this slave for the pleasure of Allah." Prophet Muhammad replied, "If you had not done so, the fire of Hell would have touched you."

[yossicl]

All monotheist religions that came after judaism is more refined and sophisticated compared to judaism. There is no point for a Muslim or Christian to convert to judaism as it would be just like downgrading your firmware. There is nothing uncovered in Quran that is being thought in the jewish religion, on the contrary, Quran is significantly more comprehensive in matters of life and beyond. The whole slavery issue is just another proof to this which can be understood in Prophet Muhammed's opinion on slavery

Yes... sophisticate... exactly the word I'm looking for.

Over the past 105 years, 14 million Jews have won 15-dozen Nobel Prizes while only three Nobel Prizes have been won by 1.4 billion Muslims (other than Peace Prizes).

William James Sidis, with an IQ of 250-300, is the brightest human who ever existed. Guess what faith did he belong to?

http://www.jang.com.pk/thenews/apr2006-dai...006/oped/o3.htm

http://jmm.aaa.net.au/articles/14150.htm

http://www.masada2000.org/nobel.html

 

Do you still believe Judaism, as it would be just like downgrading your firmware?

Well… I prefer staying with my old good firmware.

[Xeijin]

the actual movie only costs a total of 5 dollars to make, so why is it wrong for me to not want to pay 20 dollars for it?

 

Actually, it probably costs alot more than 5 dollars to 'make' seeing as they need to recuperate costs from producing the actual movie and promoting it (which runs into millions and sometimes billions as you probably know) although it does only cost them 5 dollars to create copies...

 

I agree about movies and songs, If I hear a really good album or something I usually buy it. Same with movies, often I watch movies in the cinema so I guess that pays for part of it in a way.

 

But yeah I completely agree with you, I know its not really any way to justify it but I'm 16 I couldn't honestly afford alot of the software I use, some are old licenses etc. that I scrounged but alot of it is questionable. I fully intend to when I'm older with a decent job, buy all software I use but right now as a 16 year old who is expecting £30 maintenence from colllege I'm not really there. Besides, it will be people like me who, from an early age, learnt to use software etc. created by Apple etc. become the professionals who eventually buy and use that software. A circle that I guess eventually works for these companies. (Unless those said people continue to pirate even when they're loaded )

 

I'm not trying to justify piracy or anything, I still know its definitely illegal but I hope intending to buy it when I have the money makes up for it somehow.

 

Edit: Oops guess I went a bit off topic there, sorry about that

[u1m2]

Yes... sophisticate... exactly the word I'm looking for.

Over the past 105 years, 14 million Jews have won 15-dozen Nobel Prizes while only three Nobel Prizes have been won by 1.4 billion Muslims (other than Peace Prizes).

William James Sidis, with an IQ of 250-300, is the brightest human who ever existed. Guess what faith did he belong to?

http://www.jang.com.pk/thenews/apr2006-dai...006/oped/o3.htm

http://jmm.aaa.net.au/articles/14150.htm

http://www.masada2000.org/nobel.html

 

Do you still believe Judaism, as it would be just like downgrading your firmware?

Well… I prefer staying with my old good firmware.

 

 

LMAO, you actually think that those people won nobel prizes because of the sophistication of their religion? The only contribution their religion might have made is that they prolly won those stupid prizes (whom nobody gives a {censored} about) because people who vote for them are jewish as well.

[killbot1000]

Also, theres a great deal of learning in judaism, by forcing jews to learn the torah and the talumud, in the languages they are written in, forces them to get into the habit of reading and studying which makes them smarter, it has nothing to do with them "being Jewish" only the rigorous training that comes with such a religion

[u1m2]

Look, if judaism is a religion that makes jews superior compared to the other believers how come Jews couldn't even protect themselves from genocide, fullfill the most basic task of humanity, to preserve ones own life?

 

With all the wisdom and intelligence none of the idiots saw what was going to happen at the concentration camps, did they? You know as well as I do that jews owe their sole existance to christians let alone being superior to anyone else... If judaism makes people so superior, how come atheists got their numbers during 1930-40s ?

 

Stop kidding yourselves, a jew is as stupid as the next muslim or the next christian or the next budhist. There is nothing in religion that will make people smarter, more athletic or successful academically. Religion is a matter of the soul and soul only, the babbling idiot above tried to convince himself otherwise imho because he is a failure in life and all he has got is the illusion that his religion renders him superior...

[u1m2]

Just to make one thing clear, what I wrote above is to contradict what yossicl claimed that judaism is superior to islam because more jews won nobel prizes. If his assesment is to be considered true, same can be said about nazis(atheists) being superior to the jews to the point that they exterminated them so we can also consider atheism superior to judaism. I am just trying to put some light as to how this logic can work both ways, please keep this in context.

[killbot1000]

Just to make one thing clear, what I wrote above is to contradict what yossicl claimed that judaism is superior to islam because more jews won nobel prizes. If his assesment is to be considered true, same can be said about nazis(atheists) being superior to the jews to the point that they exterminated them so we can also consider atheism superior to judaism. I am just trying to put some light as to how this logic can work both ways, please keep this in context.

 

well, being nazi and atheist are a little different, the nazi movement was a conservative movement, and it centered around the fatherland and the furer AS the god, that was the belief, not a lack of belief as in atheism, this is a common misconception about nazis

[gwprod12]

Bolsheviks can be better described as athiests than Nazis

[u1m2]

ok consider whatever religion nazis believed in and replace it with atheism as I wrote, my point was something else though... racism, nationalism or religiousness to the extent that one feels that they are superior because of 'what' they are is absolutely wrong and I wanted to prove it to our jude friend that his claims are baseless and if his method is used one can clearly come up with contradictary conclusions about the superiority(inferiority) of the jew just like I did...

[killbot1000]

ok consider whatever religion nazis believed in and replace it with atheism as I wrote, my point was something else though... racism, nationalism or religiousness to the extent that one feels that they are superior because of 'what' they are is absolutely wrong and I wanted to prove it to our jude friend that his claims are baseless and if his method is used one can clearly come up with contradictary conclusions about the superiority(inferiority) of the jew just like I did...

 

 

I totally agree, the fact is...none of us really know the truth, all we can do is draw conclusions, but none of us for sure knows if were right, and if we say we are, were just lying to ourselves heheh

[u1m2]

Thanks, I thought my original reply was quite open to the kind of interpretation I wouldn't have liked. I am glad to see I made my point clearly.

[Mebster]

Long word short, true religion requires thought and effort on the spiritual and mental side, blindly following written words or physically performing the worshipping duties is not the right path to follow in my opinion.

This guys makes some sense here.

 

Why cant I make an idol of something, WHY cant i worship another god, WHY cant I use your lords name in vain, whats the justification here, ive asked 3 times, and ive just gotten more of the same rubbish, if there was a real answer here, maybe I would be more inclined to follow it, but it seems that you dont even know why you follow them, only that you DO follow them

killbot1000 if I understand correctly i think you can, because your not Jew. You can do all of it. They wouldn't want you to do it but really these aren’t for you. It's for the Jews. Am I right here?

Also even if there was a real answer it wouldn't matter to you. You still wouldn't be able to follow it. You could try and become the best Jew ever... wouldn't mean anything as you don't have Jewish blood in you. They are a race of people (lost sheep of israel).

 

When you making idol of something, you have no “fear” because something is just something and something doesn’t give you law, reward… (Inside you, you know that it’s just something and you have no fear like killing other person, stealing etc…).

That’s a poor (pathetic really) reply. I'm sorry to say so. If you are a JEW then you are not allowed to make idols and I guess should discourage others from too. Because if you worship idols then you forget God. Even if you remember him, you are worshiping a plural number now. When you become a Muslim you say “La Ilaha Ila Allah” (“There is no god but Allah”) "Muhammad Rasulu Allah" ("Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah"). It can be said in what ever language. This is the basis of being a Muslim, Jew and I guess Christian. The idea of a single Creator. By doing this, all three religions believe you will eventually enter hellfire. That’s a basic understanding of it. But that’s for them.

 

I dont commit crimes and do bad things because its wrong, not because im afraid something will happen to me, I simply do not wish to harm another person, it has nothing to do with god, and why should it,….

You may be a good person, but ones own moral always has limitations. And when something seems too tempting then it’s easier to fall into it. Religion gives you a greater conscience. You remember that your Creator is always watching. And so provides an extra layer of protection. This is in all religions. Not just a major 3. Also many people entered Islam (especially in the far east) by admiring the manners and morals of Muslims. Once again these are sometimes explained within the Religion. Religion also opens your eye to much that otherwise you may or may not see. Backbiting in Islam is compared to ‘eating the flesh of your dead brother’ as it is a terrible thing to do. It created distrust and breaks families and the community. Many people don’t think much of it… they chat away. But having it in religion helps them understands how important it is not to. Interest is another one. Islam doesn’t allow interest as it considers it to be unfair, as it makes profit on people’s hardship. And it’s true. If I lend someone money, I don’t add interest to it. But at the same time paying back loans is considered very important. If one dies without paying of his dept his family must. So the lender feels comfort in knowing this too.

 

Conversion to Judaism is possible

http://www.soyouwanna.com/site/syws/judaism/judaism.html

True. But just look at it! (I’ll reply more to that later)

 

the point is, who would want to ?

Stuff like that annoys me (jews, christains or muslims) :angry2:. Would be ok if you gave a reason. Otherwise just sounds hateful towards Jews.

[killbot1000]

This guys makes some sense here.

 

killbot1000 if I understand correctly i think you can, because your not Jew. You can do all of it. They wouldn't want you to do it but really these aren’t for you. It's for the Jews. Am I right here?

Also even if there was a real answer it wouldn't matter to you. You still wouldn't be able to follow it. You could try and become the best Jew ever... wouldn't mean anything as you don't have Jewish blood in you. They are a race of people (lost sheep of israel).

 

That’s a poor (pathetic really) reply. I'm sorry to say so. If you are a JEW then you are not allowed to make idols and I guess should discourage others from too. Because if you worship idols then you forget God. Even if you remember him, you are worshiping a plural number now. When you become a Muslim you say “La Ilaha Ila Allah” (“There is no god but Allah”) "Muhammad Rasulu Allah" ("Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah"). It can be said in what ever language. This is the basis of being a Muslim, Jew and I guess Christian. The idea of a single Creator. By doing this all three believe you will eventually enter hellfire. That’s a basic understanding of it. But that’s for them.

 

You may be a good person, but ones own moral always has limitations. And when something seems too tempting then it’s easier to fall into it. Religion gives you a greater conscience. You remember that your Creator is always watching. And so provides an extra layer of protection. This is in all religions. Not just a major 3. Also many people entered Islam (especially in the far east) by admiring the manners and morals of Muslims. Once again these are sometimes explained within the Religion. Religion also opens your eye to much that otherwise you may or may not see. Backbiting in Islam is compared to ‘eating the flesh of your dead brother’ as it is a terrible thing to do. It created distrust and breaks families and the community. Many people don’t think much of it… they chat away. But having it in religion helps them understands how important it is not to. Interest is another one. Islam doesn’t allow interest as it considers it to be unfair, as it makes profit on people’s hardship. And it’s true. If I lend someone money, I don’t add interest to it. But at the same time paying back loans is considered very important. If one dies without paying of his dept his family must. So the lender feels comfort in knowing this too.

 

True. But just look at it! (I’ll reply more to that later)

 

Stuff like that annoys me (jews, christains or muslims) . Would be ok if you gave a reason. Otherwise just sounds hateful towards Jews.

 

 

I really dont know why...maybe im a freak...but ive never really had a problem doing the right thing, sure ive made mistakes, just like any person, but nothing as epic as "falling into temptation". Ive learned that doing the right thing, even if it hurts you at the time, usually pays off, bad things have not really happened to me by doing the right thing, so I keep doing them, even if it sucks hard {censored} at the time...

 

Friends of mine have commented on my "willpower" and "self-control", but I really dont even try...im not bragging or anything...but its just the person I am. I have a character, and I usually stick to it, and its done me well in life, my trick (cold calculating logic, evidence, proof to back up my beliefs) hasnt failed me yet

[yossicl]

LMAO, you actually think that those people won nobel prizes because of the sophistication of their religion? The only contribution their religion might have made is that they prolly won those stupid prizes (whom nobody gives a {censored} about) because people who vote for them are jewish as well.

So people who vote those stupid prizes for Yasser Arafat (Man of Peace ) are jewish ?

Yes… you sounds like good old Muslim…

 

 

Also, theres a great deal of learning in judaism, by forcing jews to learn the torah and the talumud, in the languages they are written in, forces them to get into the habit of reading and studying which makes them smarter, it has nothing to do with them "being Jewish" only the rigorous training that comes with such a religion

"being Jewish" this is the key.

 

 

Look, if judaism is a religion that makes jews superior compared to the other believers how come Jews couldn't even protect themselves from genocide, fullfill the most basic task of humanity, to preserve ones own life?

 

With all the wisdom and intelligence none of the idiots saw what was going to happen at the concentration camps, did they? You know as well as I do that jews owe their sole existance to christians let alone being superior to anyone else... If judaism makes people so superior, how come atheists got their numbers during 1930-40s ?

Superior - No, Smarter - Yes (donn't be jealous).

You can say the same on (superior) Egypt empire, Roman empire, Babylon empire, Persian empire, Byzantine empire, Ottoman empire etcetera etcetera etcetera they couldn't even protect themselves from disappearing (surprise... the Jews still exist here because of God wishing but no thanks to Christianity inquisition).

So I really don’t understand what is your context.

…how come atheists got their numbers during 1930-40s?

Of the record, maybe this is the reason that God send the Nazis to bring them back to their source, who knows?

…Stop kidding yourselves, a jew is as stupid as the next muslim or the next christian or the next budhist. There is nothing in religion that will make people smarter, more athletic or successful academically. Religion is a matter of the soul and soul only, the babbling idiot above tried to convince himself otherwise imho because he is a failure in life and all he has got is the illusion that his religion renders him superior...

Did you read what you wrote before?

All monotheist religions that came after judaism is more refined and sophisticated compared to judaism. There is no point for a Muslim or Christian to convert to judaism as it would be just like downgrading your firmware. There is nothing uncovered in Quran that is being thought in the jewish religion, on the contrary, Quran is significantly more comprehensive in matters of life and beyond. The whole slavery issue is just another proof to this which can be understood in Prophet Muhammed's opinion on slavery

Then you telling us some Arabian Nights fantasy story (alf layla wa layla)....

So who is the babbling idiot above tried to convince himself otherwise imho because he is a failure in life and all he has got is the fantasy that his religion renders him more refined and sophisticated...

Do a favor stop kidding yourselves and stop kidding us.

 

Just to make one thing clear, what I wrote above is to contradict what yossicl claimed that judaism is superior to islam because more jews won nobel prizes. If his assesment is to be considered true, same can be said about nazis(atheists) being superior to the jews to the point that they exterminated them so we can also consider atheism superior to judaism. I am just trying to put some light as to how this logic can work both ways, please keep this in context.

Again, superior - No, smarter – Yes

btw, I see those stupid Nobel prizes (whom nobody gives a {censored} about) bothering you, any reason?

The thing is the Jews are not demonstrating with their dead on the streets, yelling and chanting and asking for revenge, the Jews are not promoting brain-washing the children in military training camps, teaching them how to blow themselves up and cause maximum deaths of Jews and other non Muslims. The Jews don't hijack planes, nor kill athletes at the Olympics, the Jews don't traffic slaves, nor have leaders calling for Jihad and death to all the Infidels.

The Jews don't have the economical strength of Petroleum, nor the possibilities to force the world's media to see "their side" of the question.

Perhaps if the world's Muslims could invest more in normal education and less in blaming the Jews for all their problems, we could all live in a better world.

 

Listen to the following link

http://switch5.castup.net/frames/20041020_...wmv&ak=null

And you will learn something.

 

I think I clear myself.

[yossicl]

You may be a good person, but ones own moral always has limitations. And when something seems too tempting then it’s easier to fall into it. Religion gives you a greater conscience. You remember that your Creator is always watching. And so provides an extra layer of protection. This is in all religions. Not just a major 3. Also many people entered Islam (especially in the far east) by admiring the manners and morals of Muslims. Once again these are sometimes explained within the Religion. Religion also opens your eye to much that otherwise you may or may not see. Backbiting in Islam is compared to ‘eating the flesh of your dead brother’ as it is a terrible thing to do. It created distrust and breaks families and the community. Many people don’t think much of it… they chat away. But having it in religion helps them understands how important it is not to. Interest is another one. Islam doesn’t allow interest as it considers it to be unfair, as it makes profit on people’s hardship. And it’s true. If I lend someone money, I don’t add interest to it. But at the same time paying back loans is considered very important. If one dies without paying of his dept his family must. So the lender feels comfort in knowing this too.

Well finally we have something in common (just replace the word Muslim with Jew it will sound like more genuine).

[Mebster]

Well finally we have something in common (just replace the word Muslim with Jew it will sound like more genuine).

I was thinking from an Islamic point of view. But your right, this is something we (and christians have in common).

 

"just replace the word Muslim with Jew it will sound like more genuine" - The replacing part in the end sounds like an attack. Why do I need to replace?

Replacing the word isn't necessary as although i was thinking about Islam when I wrote them, I also knew Judaism and Christianity also are likely to share the same beliefs.

[yossicl]

I was thinking from an Islamic point of view. But your right, this is something we (and christians have in common).

 

"just replace the word Muslim with Jew it will sound like more genuine" - The replacing part in the end sounds like an attack. Why do I need to replace?

Replacing the word isn't necessary as although i was thinking about Islam when I wrote them, I also knew Judaism and Christianity also was likely to share the same beliefs.

Sorry, it wasn’t personally I didn't meant to attacked you.

 

Btw, the picture in the avatar is your Hajj?

[killbot1000]

"being Jewish" this is the key.

 

Yeah...whatever...

[u1m2]

LMAO, The guy tries so hard to prove that Jews are smarter yet he doesn't realize he hurts his cause solely by just posting in this topic. You have only proved yourself stupid thereby lowering the jewish average dude, in case you haven't noticed already...

 

If judaism made people smarter you really should go back to reading your teurot and hope that what you claimed before is true as it seems to be the only way to salvation for your remaining gray cells. Finally, believe me when I say you personally set a very poor example to prove your claims that jews are smarter.