[HowTo] Building an overclocked Core2Duo box for OSx86.

[Sabr]

The Gigabyte GA-965P-DS3 now is fully functional. We have the IDE port working, and full SATA read/write support. Go here (first post for more info):

 

http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?sho...=26858&st=0

 

SABR.

[bofors]

 

I finally ordered my parts, and now have built and overclocked my Conroe box. But before I start detailing the results, I am going to show an itemized list of what I bought (and what I had), why I bought it, where I bought it and for how much (including shipping and handling charges which can be significant).

 

Part :: Model Number :: Vendor :: Price :: Shipping

Motherboard :: Refurbished Intel D975XBX :: Mwave :: $107.99 :: ~$10.00

 

There was a killer deal on refurbished Bad Axe's at Mwave. It was not clear if I was going to receive a Conroe ready version, but I did, a 305 and it came with a complete set of parts. I managed to get another $10 off the price by manipulating an online Mwave coupon survey offer. Had I not gotten lucky with Mwave, NewEgg regularly sells "open box" Bad Axe's for $160 shipped.

 

My choice of a Bad Axe here was largely motivated by the Mwave deal, but not entirely. As discussed elsewhere, 965 chipset boards still have had issues with running OSx86 and this will likely be an issue until Apple releases a 965 based Mac. So, the choices narrow to 945 and 975 chipsets, and it has been shown that the 945 does not overclock as well. Finally, Intel boards are regarded as being extremely stable, this is more important than overclocking to me, and also they support EFI which is something I am working on.

 

As far as overclocking goes, Intel's Bad Axe has fewer options than other boards. The use of the Windows program "clockgen" can help get around this issue, but it is not clear it something like that can work with OSx86 or not (note that some 10.4.8 kernels allow one to set the FSB frequency with significant effect).

 

CPU :: Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 (Retail Box) :: NewEgg :: $183.00 :: Free

 

I choose the E6300 because it is the cheapest. I did consider E6600 but it is almost twice the price and certainly does not offer anything near twice the performance. While the E6600 has a 4MB cache (versus the E6300's 2 MB), AnandTech has shown that is not a significant in performance over a wide range of applications. While the E6600 would overclock higher with its greater multiplier of 9 (versus 7 with E6300), the E4300 which also has multiplier of 9 will be available in a few months for even less than E6300. This makes investing in the E6600 even less attractive.

 

I opted to spend a few more dollars for the retail "box" version, which includes a heatsink-fan assembly that I do not plan use, because there is a rumor that the retail version is of higher quality than the OEM one.

 

CPU HeatSink :: ThermalTake Big Typhoon :: NewEgg :: $38.99 :: Free

 

The Big Typhoon is one of the best value CPU coolers available. Because it is oriented "perpendicular" to the motherboard (as opposed to "tower" coolers), it cools the voltage regulation circuitry and other components as well as the CPU. Furthermore, this orientation mean it can intake cool air directly through a case side hole.

 

CPU Fan :: Vantec / Sunon 120 x 38 :: eWiz :: $8.76 :: ~$5.00

 

This data indicates that the Big Typhoon's cooling power is a strong function of fan power: http://forum.abit-usa.com/showthread.php?t=103462&page=4 With a strong fan, the Big Typhoon can significantly outperform high end coolers.

 

The Vantec-marketed Sunon I got rotates at 3100 RPM and pushes 108 CFM at 42 dBA. While I have this attached to the CPU fan header on my motherboard, hoping that it would slow and quiet down, it is still a little louder than I would like in my rather open case. I may work on this latter by getting a 30 dBA fan or by slowing this one by stepping the voltage down from 12V to 7V.

 

Northbridge and Memory Fans :: Delta 50 x 10 :: BuyExtra.com :: 4 x $3.49 :: ~$3.00

 

Northbridge cooling is critical to Conroe overclocking. While the best choice is the ThermalTake Free Spirit II cooler, it is over $20.00 and comes with a weak fan. These high quality Delta fans were at a good price, so I ordered four for both northbridge and memory cooling. Two 50mm fans are little large for the Intel northbridge heatsink (two 40mm's would fit perfect), but these 5500 RPM, 11.4 CFM Delta's push much more air than others in this size range. They supposed to be 30 dBA, but they seem fairly quiet to me.

 

Fans Cables :: BuyExtra.com :: $5:40 :: ~$2.25

 

I bought two 3-to-4 pin adapters for the four 50mm Delta fans (these are "two headed" or "Y" adapters) and 4-to-3 pin adapter to hook the Vantec/Sunon fan to the CPU fan header on the motherboard.

 

Memory Heatspreaders :: Evercool Copper :: BuyExtra.com :: 2 x 3.95 :: ~ $3.00

 

I am using Corsair Value Select DDR2 2 x 1GB memory I already had, but it did not have heatspeaders. I choose copper over aluminum for better performance.

 

Arctic Silver Thermal Adhesive :: eWiz :: $6.75 :: ~$4.00

 

The Evercool heatspreaders come with 3M thermal tape. Since I am using "value" RAM, I want high performance here instead. This Artic Silver epoxy is much better at conducting heat from the memory chips to the heatspreader where the fans can dissipate it.

 

Case :: CoolerMaster Centurion 5 :: Mwave :: $45.00 :: ~$12.00

 

This is a high value, quality case which has the basic features I want: no "front door", side intake hole and mesh front panel. It is only designed to hold three hard drives but it is easy to get five in. The fans that come with it are pretty weak and I would rather have an 120 fan in the front to cool the hard drives (not the 80mm that this case is designed for).

 

PSU :: Ultra V-Series "500W" :: Frys / Output.com :: Free (or $4.50) after rebate :: Free

 

I discussed this PSU in detail here: http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?showtopic=30232 I actually got two of these since I thought they were such a good deal (umm... free) and am having no problems with them.

 

Graphics Card :: XFX Nvidia 7600GS :: eWiz :: $106 :: Free

 

My graphics requirements solely involve being able to run dual displays. While a 7300GT would have probably worked for me, they are designed to share system memory and I want all of that available to the OS. eWiz had the 7600GS on sale for only about $15 more than the 7300GT, so I ordered that instead. I have only been looking at dual DVI cards (I do not want a VGA port, I will use adapters if necessary).

 

[Note, this is the only part I have not received yet. I ordered a PowerColor x1600Pro before Titan came out and have picked up a 3D Fusion 7600GS to use until my XFX card comes in a few days.]

 

Hard Drives :: Refurbished Western Digital 40GB SATA 2MB Cache :: 4 x $19.97 :: $7.99

 

I was not happy about how much money I spent on Raptors last time I built a box, but very impressed with RAID. So, I decided to build a cheap quad RAID set here. I have discussed the results here: http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?showtopic=31899

 

Sandpaper :: AutoZone :: ~$15.00 :: N/A

 

I bought 400, 800, 1000 and 1500 grit sandpaper to lap the Big Typhoon, and North and SouthBridge heatsinks. (The 1000 grit could have been skipped and if the store carried something like 3000 grit I would have bought that too). I did not lap the CPU itself and it does not appear to be needed either, although it is slightly convex (by about one degree).

 

CableTies and Sleeving :: AutoZone :: ~$10.00 :: N/A

 

I bought a bag of 100 "zipper lock" cable fasters and 4 feet of 1/2 inch plastic cable sleeving. It seems that auto parts stores have some useful things for building a computer at cheap prices.

 

Total Goods: $634.13 Shipping: ~$47.24 Grand: ~$681.37

 

 

Below are items I used which I had already.

 

 

These things I detailed in the price list from my last build: http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?showtopic=7393

 

Arctic Silver (thermal interface material), I used this to mount the Big Typhoon, and North and SouthBridge heatsinks.

 

Corsair ValueSelect DDR-667 / PC5300 VS2GBKIT667D2 (2 x 1GB).

 

Apple keyboard.

 

Logitech MX-510 mouse.

 

 

 

 

These things I got from taking apart a non-functional HP Pentium III machine:

 

20 GB IDE 5400 Hard Drive for OS X install (it is not possible to boot off a RAID array in OSx86).

 

3.5"-to-5.25" mounting brackets for the IDE drive.

 

Samsung DVD-ROM, OSx86 does not seem to able to boot from this.

 

80mm Panaflo fan, I used this to supplement the weak 80mm fan that came with my case to cool the hard drives.

 

40mm Sunon fan, I used this to cool the Southbridge.

 

Fan cables.

[bofors]

 

I am using the stock ThermalTake Big Typhoon fan for exhaust and moved the weany CoolerMaster 120mm exhuast fan to the front for intake. The Centurion case front has holes which make it pretty easy to mount additional fan to.

 

 

 

 

I used some rubber bands to create a mounting mechanism for the memory fans, I wanted something that would come off without tools.

 

 

Below is a close up of the Northbridge fans, 50mm fans do not fit perfectly but 40mm's would.

 

 

Next is the Southbridge, the 40mm fan fits perfectly.

 

 

This is the wimpy stock Centurion 120mm "exhaust" fan that I moved to the front for intake, right below the IDE drives.

 

 

I moved the front 80mm fan up from its stock position so I could insert another 80mm fan directly below it, in front of the hard drives (not visible).

 

 

The paint job on the Certurion is actually a nice "flat" (no gloss) black finish, but the flash makes the grease from my hands stand out.

 

 

The CPU fan comes to about 4cm from the case side and slighly offset down. I took the stock intake duct off because it was too long to fit and too narrow for a 120mm fan, but something else could be added here.

 

[icyderguru]

Bofors: You just need to short the marked yellow OC Debug holes shown in the link.

http://forums.vr-zone.com/showthread.php?t=78432

 

This will unlock the Overclocking Options. The Bios Option is called Override Default Configuration or something like that, you realy have to look closely, at first i thought i have done something wrong but then i found out that everything went fine but i couldnt find the additional options :-)

 

However, the Board is a bit tricky when it comes to overclocking. Sometimes it can happen that even the failsafe jumper isnt working, then you have to take out the bios battery or shorten the hidden cmos clear which is also on the board but they havent installed pin holders..

 

There are different FSB Strips which you can use.

 

1066 (default) you can also add 50% FSB speed = max 399 FSB

1333 (overclocked) you can also add 50% FSB speed = max 499 FSB

 

With 2 Ram Sticks i could use the 1333 FSB Strap, with 4 i couldnt. In my case my 6600 was running with 2 Sticks at 3720 Mhz (333 strap +24% = 413FSB)

 

With 3 or 4 Sticks i only could use the 1066 Strap and maxed out at 266+50%=399*9=3591 FSB (dont know why, but i know somebody who actualy uses the 333 strap with 4 sticks)

 

There is also a BIOS Modifying Kit provided by Intel but havent looked at that for myself (you could modify the bios so you dont have to shorten the OC Debug pins)

 

hth

[joe75]

Looks great :censored2:

 

I have always liked the CoolerMaster Centurion 5, and you got it at a pretty good price.

 

I have never liked Vantec / Sunon 120 x 38, they just seem so load, but if you can get past the noise, they do push some air.

 

I looked at the ThermalTake Free Spirit II,but passed it up for my Jing Ting Forcetake Offset Heatpipe Chipset Cooler ,I dumped the 40mm and used a 50x15 fan.

For my board the northbridge is directly behind the video card and the Jing Ting offered an offset.

 

My last Intel was a Pentium III (Coppermine) 1GHz, then I jumped to a AMD +3000 ClawHammer, I was so impressed with AMD that I purchased 2 more, I said I would never buy Intel again.

 

Then I bought my new notebook with a T5600, it was offered with a T2400, the price was right so I didn't care about it having Intel. The speed and performance is so good I almost forget its a laptop.

 

Well, never say never. The new core 2s have blown me away and now I plan on building around a E6400, I considered the E6300, but I feel the 4mb is better. When I do my build I will give a report, though I am not a huge bargain hunter as you, the build should stay under $1000

[bofors]

Now for some overclocking results on 10.4.5 (I will be working with 10.4.8 next). For comparison, this is the CPU, Thread and Memory Xbench (v 1.3) from my first box, an Intel D945GNTLKR, Pentium D 920 (2.8 GHz) and Consair Value Select DDR2-667 (4-4-4-12, 1.8V):

 

Results	95.40	
System Info		
	Xbench Version		1.3
	System Version		10.4.5 (8G1454)
	Physical RAM		2048 MB
	Model		ADP2,1
	Drive Type		HDT722525DLA380
CPU Test	61.86	
	GCD Loop	84.84	4.47 Mops/sec
	Floating Point Basic	71.03	1.69 Gflop/sec
	vecLib FFT	43.94	1.45 Gflop/sec
	Floating Point Library	62.37	10.86 Mops/sec
Thread Test	152.47	
	Computation	137.59	2.79 Mops/sec, 4 threads
	Lock Contention	170.96	7.35 Mlocks/sec, 4 threads
Memory Test	114.62	
	System	94.28	
		Allocate	62.91	231.02 Kalloc/sec
		Fill	128.29	6237.94 MB/sec
		Copy	123.00	2540.51 MB/sec
	Stream	146.16	
		Copy	139.24	2875.89 MB/sec
		Scale	140.20	2896.43 MB/sec
		Add	153.72	3274.67 MB/sec
		Triad	152.75	3267.76 MB/sec

 

Below are the results from the Bad Axe / E6300 running the same model of Corsair ValueSelect RAM, but set to 5-5-5-15 at 2.2V. The other voltages were vCore at 1.275V, vMCH at 1.65V and vFSB 1.271V. The overclock was done by setting memory at 667 MHz and using 1333 "strap" (FSB) plus 40% "host burn-in" (which is how the Bad Axe BIOS overclocks). These parameters translate to a CPU clock of 3.27 GHz, an FSB of 467 MHz and RAM speed of 934 MHz. The overclock appears to be 100% stable after some six hours of testing.

 

EDIT: This is a retail box E6300, L629A293 (that is, manufactured in the 29th week of 2006). I assume it is a "6 B2" stepping (revision), but I am not sure how to tell.

 

EDIT2: After running fine for about two weeks, the system started to freeze under full loads on a single core. I tried to raise the vCore (to 1.4V) but it seemed to have not effect. But raising the vMCH to 1.725V appears to have solved problem. This is same story, the vMCH is the critical parameter here and on this system vCore continues to seem irrelevant. Again, this is why northbridge cooling is so important. Unfortunately, I am now at the max. of vMCH range in BIOS.

 

Results	217.77	
System Info		
	Xbench Version		1.3
	System Version		10.4.5 (8G1454)
	Physical RAM		2048 MB
	Model		ADP2,1
	Drive Type		IBM-DTLA-305020
CPU Test	161.49	
	GCD Loop	385.47	20.32 Mops/sec
	Floating Point Basic	185.30	4.40 Gflop/sec
	vecLib FFT	116.48	3.84 Gflop/sec
	Floating Point Library	122.05	21.25 Mops/sec
Thread Test	327.85	
	Computation	298.91	6.06 Mops/sec, 4 threads
	Lock Contention	363.00	15.62 Mlocks/sec, 4 threads
Memory Test	220.59	
	System	215.68	
		Allocate	168.18	617.63 Kalloc/sec
		Fill	261.51	12715.23 MB/sec
		Copy	241.56	4989.28 MB/sec
	Stream	225.73	
		Copy	230.11	4752.75 MB/sec
		Scale	228.55	4721.82 MB/sec
		Add	224.54	4783.24 MB/sec
		Triad	219.98	4705.87 MB/sec

[bofors]

Bofors: You just need to short the marked yellow OC Debug holes shown in the link.

http://forums.vr-zone.com/showthread.php?t=78432

 

This will unlock the Overclocking Options. The Bios Option is called Override Default Configuration or something like that, you realy have to look closely, at first i thought i have done something wrong but then i found out that everything went fine but i couldnt find the additional options :-)

 

Right, I actually did the "OC Debug" mod yesterday (I guess I forgot to add $6.49 plus tax for a Circuit Writer pen ). Nice pictures here: http://forums.legitreviews.com/about6375.html

 

(You have to do it to use the 1333 strap on the E6300.)

 

However, the Board is a bit tricky when it comes to overclocking. Sometimes it can happen that even the failsafe jumper isnt working, then you have to take out the bios battery or shorten the hidden cmos clear which is also on the board but they havent installed pin holders..

Contary to what AnandTech has reported it is not necessary to remove the battery to recover from a bad overclock. On just move the BIOS jumper into the "Configure" position.

 

With 2 Ram Sticks i could use the 1333 FSB Strap, with 4 i couldnt. In my case my 6600 was running with 2 Sticks at 3720 Mhz (333 strap +24% = 413FSB)

 

With 3 or 4 Sticks i only could use the 1066 Strap and maxed out at 266+50%=399*9=3591 FSB (dont know why, but i know somebody who actualy uses the 333 strap with 4 sticks)

 

Well, there are potentially some problems with the implementation of 1333 strap on the Bad Axe: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=105703 The guys over at XtremeSystems avoid it and use "clockgen" with the 1066 strap to go above 50% instead. Of course, "clockgen" is not an option for OS X (yet).

 

Using 3 sticks will disable dual channel memory mode, so I would not be surprised to see problems with that. I have another set of the same Corsair "value" RAM, so I can test 4 sticks latter.

 

There is also a BIOS Modifying Kit provided by Intel but havent looked at that for myself (you could modify the bios so you dont have to shorten the OC Debug pins)

 

It is called the Integrators Tool Kit (ITK), it was availible here: http://biosrepair.com/. It also lets you add a custom logo to the BIOS.

 

I have always liked the CoolerMaster Centurion 5, and you got it at a pretty good price.

NewEgg periodically offers them for $35 after a $10 rebate, that is best deal I have seen. But with shipping that only comes out to be a few dollars less than what I paid.

 

I have never liked Vantec / Sunon 120 x 38, they just seem so load, but if you can get past the noise, they do push some air.

I am going to be fixing the noise problem pronto. My E6300 runs very cool, that fan is total overkill right now. It is too bad that the BIOS does not slow the fan down more when it clearly is not needed.

 

I looked at the ThermalTake Free Spirit II,but passed it up for my Jing Ting Forcetake Offset Heatpipe Chipset Cooler ,I dumped the 40mm and used a 50x15 fan.

For my board the northbridge is directly behind the video card and the Jing Ting offered an offset.

 

I spent about $8 on Northbridge cooling and it seems to work great. The Jing Ting heatsinks are even more expensive the ThermalTake Free Spirit II (like $30).

 

The new core 2s have blown me away and now I plan on building around a E6400, I considered the E6300, but I feel the 4mb is better.

 

Well then you will have to get E6600, the E6400 only has 2MB of cache. When the E4300 comes out, that extra 2MB of cache will cost as much as another chip (or more). If I got some significant performance increase from it (and I might with the software I run), I would buy it. But AnandTech found that under normal conditions there is almost no benefit, 3.5% improvement on average, 10% max: http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showd...?i=2795&p=4

[greenman100]

e6400 @ 3.2ghz until I get my watercooling:

 

no disk test for now, need SATA drive

 

 

 Results	249.45	
System Info		
	Xbench Version		1.3
	System Version		10.4.6 (8I1119)
	Physical RAM		2048 MB
	Model		ADP2,1
	Drive Type		HDT722516DLAT80
CPU Test	158.18	
	GCD Loop	379.68	20.01 Mops/sec
	Floating Point Basic	182.63	4.34 Gflop/sec
	vecLib FFT	113.38	3.74 Gflop/sec
	Floating Point Library	119.64	20.83 Mops/sec
Thread Test	321.64	
	Computation	294.05	5.96 Mops/sec, 4 threads
	Lock Contention	354.94	15.27 Mlocks/sec, 4 threads
Memory Test	199.39	
	System	196.17	
		Allocate	159.45	585.54 Kalloc/sec
		Fill	240.99	11717.68 MB/sec
		Copy	205.27	4239.68 MB/sec
	Stream	202.72	
		Copy	189.79	3920.14 MB/sec
		Scale	190.87	3943.40 MB/sec
		Add	217.02	4622.99 MB/sec
		Triad	216.67	4635.02 MB/sec
Quartz Graphics Test	237.78	
	Line	197.38	13.14 Klines/sec [50% alpha]
	Rectangle	246.24	73.52 Krects/sec [50% alpha]
	Circle	232.65	18.96 Kcircles/sec [50% alpha]
	Bezier	216.67	5.46 Kbeziers/sec [50% alpha]
	Text	334.80	20.94 Kchars/sec
OpenGL Graphics Test	257.42	
	Spinning Squares	257.42	326.55 frames/sec
User Interface Test	659.43	
	Elements	659.43	3.03 Krefresh/sec

 

3.6ghz, 450 FSB

 

that's on stock cooling, stock volts. there is more left in this chip.

 

what's a 100 in CPU test represent?

 

 Results	275.60	
System Info		
	Xbench Version		1.3
	System Version		10.4.6 (8I1119)
	Physical RAM		2048 MB
	Model		ADP2,1
	Drive Type		HDT722516DLAT80
CPU Test	179.29	
	GCD Loop	424.70	22.39 Mops/sec
	Floating Point Basic	205.18	4.88 Gflop/sec
	vecLib FFT	130.84	4.32 Gflop/sec
	Floating Point Library	134.43	23.41 Mops/sec
Thread Test	359.42	
	Computation	330.19	6.69 Mops/sec, 4 threads
	Lock Contention	394.32	16.96 Mlocks/sec, 4 threads
Memory Test	226.84	
	System	231.04	
		Allocate	185.89	682.65 Kalloc/sec
		Fill	270.58	13156.11 MB/sec
		Copy	255.79	5283.19 MB/sec
	Stream	222.79	
		Copy	195.22	4032.26 MB/sec
		Scale	198.86	4108.41 MB/sec
		Add	257.67	5488.88 MB/sec
		Triad	254.97	5454.53 MB/sec
Quartz Graphics Test	266.36	
	Line	221.45	14.74 Klines/sec [50% alpha]
	Rectangle	277.81	82.94 Krects/sec [50% alpha]
	Circle	266.85	21.75 Kcircles/sec [50% alpha]
	Bezier	243.10	6.13 Kbeziers/sec [50% alpha]
	Text	357.70	22.38 Kchars/sec
OpenGL Graphics Test	292.15	
	Spinning Squares	292.15	370.60 frames/sec
User Interface Test	547.74	
	Elements	547.74	2.51 Krefresh/sec

[greenman100]

I'm pretty sure I have the highest reported CPU xBench score. Lots of people are cheating the overall scores with RAMdisks.

 

My full score with RAMdisk:

 

Results	326.85	
System Info		
	Xbench Version		1.3
	System Version		10.4.6 (8I1119)
	Physical RAM		2048 MB
	Model		ADP2,1
	Drive Type		Apple read/write
CPU Test	177.72	
	GCD Loop	425.02	22.40 Mops/sec
	Floating Point Basic	203.73	4.84 Gflop/sec
	vecLib FFT	128.25	4.23 Gflop/sec
	Floating Point Library	134.25	23.38 Mops/sec
Thread Test	362.38	
	Computation	331.08	6.71 Mops/sec, 4 threads
	Lock Contention	400.20	17.22 Mlocks/sec, 4 threads
Memory Test	225.29	
	System	225.20	
		Allocate	165.55	607.97 Kalloc/sec
		Fill	270.63	13158.67 MB/sec
		Copy	278.86	5759.75 MB/sec
	Stream	225.37	
		Copy	199.60	4122.67 MB/sec
		Scale	202.87	4191.29 MB/sec
		Add	256.70	5468.31 MB/sec
		Triad	255.53	5466.38 MB/sec
Quartz Graphics Test	295.37	
	Line	224.12	14.92 Klines/sec [50% alpha]
	Rectangle	277.30	82.79 Krects/sec [50% alpha]
	Circle	266.37	21.71 Kcircles/sec [50% alpha]
	Bezier	242.49	6.12 Kbeziers/sec [50% alpha]
	Text	1018.25	63.70 Kchars/sec
OpenGL Graphics Test	293.94	
	Spinning Squares	293.94	372.87 frames/sec
User Interface Test	763.22	
	Elements	763.22	3.50 Krefresh/sec
Disk Test	2026.73	
	Sequential	1277.15	
		Uncached Write	923.09	566.77 MB/sec [4K blocks]
		Uncached Write	2755.81	1559.24 MB/sec [256K blocks]
		Uncached Read	688.27	201.42 MB/sec [4K blocks]
		Uncached Read	4294.31	2158.29 MB/sec [256K blocks]
	Random	4906.39	
		Uncached Write	2029.16	214.81 MB/sec [4K blocks]
		Uncached Write	4940.01	1581.48 MB/sec [256K blocks]
		Uncached Read	26935.86	190.88 MB/sec [4K blocks]
		Uncached Read	12063.75	2238.51 MB/sec [256K blocks]

 

 

 

Sorry, Don.

[joe75]

you will have to get E6600, the E6400 only has 2MB of cache

 

Yes, the E6600

[marliwahoo]

I'm drooling.

 

I want one.

[subtext1]

The reference (=100) is an Apple PPC with G5 Dual CPU at 2 GHz.

 

what's a 100 in CPU test represent?

[bofors]

that's on stock cooling, stock volts. there is more left in this chip.

 

While I am not positive (and certainly not complaining), I am pretty sure I am close to reaching the limit on my system. I had to raise vMCH (NorthBridge voltage) from the minimum, but vCore and and vFSB are turned all the way down, but I did enable Enhanced Power Slope (which is supposed to minimize "vDroop"). Although my system was stable enough to boot OS X and run Xbench at 3.38 GHz (533 memory, 1333 strap + 45%), it would not post at FSB 500, 3.5 GHz (1333 strap + 50%) at maxmum voltages. Interestingly, raising vCore all the way up to 1.6V, seemed to do nothing other than significantly raise the CPU temperature.

 

But my "value" RAM does not seem to be holding me back either, dropping from 667 to 533 or lower modes had no effect, 3.38 GHz (FSB 483 MHz) and higher were not stable or not even POST. Because my CPU seems to run so cool and vCore seems to add no improvement, I am suspect my Bad Axe or northbridge is the limit of my overclock. This is why northbridge cooling is so important here, I may be hitting the limit of the stock aluminum northbridge heatsink and get (slightly) better results with something make of copper like the ThermalTake Free Spirit II.

 

On the other hand, if I was running an E6600 or E4300 (with a multiplier of 9) at my FSB of 466, my CPU would be clocking at 4.2 GHz (which is pretty respectable).

 

4.2 GHz??? Damm... maybe I should spring for an E6600... ney, I will just wait for the E4300.

 

Lots of people are cheating the overall scores with RAMdisks.

 

... and I felt guilty about posting Xbenchs off a non-bootable RAID set.

[icyderguru]

the most 6600 core 2 duos max out around 3,6 -3,8 ghz

 

you would need phase change cooling to go above that

 

MAYBE a 6700 (but they are very expensive) could hit the 4ghz mark, but you would need to get a realy good stepping

 

your overclock is pretty good (your mobo chipset cooling realy payed off!)

 

btw 333+50% = 499,5*7=3496,50 MHZ

 

please also try if you can do the same with 4 memory sticks

[greenman100]

the most 6600 core 2 duos max out around 3,6 -3,8 ghz

 

you would need phase change cooling to go above that

 

MAYBE a 6700 (but they are very expensive) could hit the 4ghz mark, but you would need to get a realy good stepping

 

your overclock is pretty good (your mobo chipset cooling realy payed off!)

 

btw 333+50% = 499,5*7=3496,50 MHZ

 

please also try if you can do the same with 4 memory sticks

 

 

 

there are 6400s at 4ghz stable on air cooling

[bofors]

I took the box apart and reoriented the Big Typhoon so the heat pipes are no longer obstructing the northbridge fans. I then remounted the fans on the northbridge heatsink with epoxy.

 

 

The memory fans are no longer being pushed by the northbridge fans.

 

 

More importantly, northbridge fans are not touching the graphics card now.

 

 

Finally, I added a 25 Ohm rheostat ($3.99 at RadioShack) to quiet the Sunon and tried to do a better job with the cables.

 

 

The box is still much louder than my Sonata II or my G5, but I think it is down to about 30 dBA. Now, it seems like the loudest fans are actually the stock Centurion 80mm and 120mm which are destined to get replaced anyways.

 

EDIT: I actually had to disconnect all the fans but the big Sunon cooling the CPU to narrow it down. The 40mm Sunon I have on the southbridge is the loudest followed by the four 50mm Deltas (trying to slow the Deltas down by running off the rheostat did not seem to have any effect on their noise) I have on the northbridge and RAM. These are going to be replaced with quiet (~20 dBA) fans and I think the result will be a fairly quiet box. It is not really loud now, but it certainly is not quiet computer either.

[joe75]

I'm hoping to run a E6600 at 4.2 at least

[greenman100]

I'm hoping to run a E6600 at 4.2 at least

 

 

 

not on anything short of phase, tell you that

[bofors]

the most 6600 core 2 duos max out around 3,6 -3,8 ghz

 

Here is some data regarding Conroe overclocks. First the [H]ardForum database: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1075...age=1&pp=20

 

Although this data might be a little dated with old steppings, [H]ardforum reports these averages:

 

E6300 :: 3.136

E6400 :: 3.242

E6600 :: 3.384

E6700 :: 3.573

X6800 :: 3.640

 

So, I managed to beat average of the E6300 and E6400 with 3.26 GHz (I could probably squeze out another 50 MHz or so becaue I did not test anything in the 41-44% burn-in range (1333 strap)). But looking over all of the [H]ardForum data, Bad Axes certainly do not appear to be the best boards for maxium overclocking. The best Bad Axe result is by Eva2000 who clocked E6600's to 3.75 GHz. I also noticed that Wickedld9 posted an E6300 at the minimum voltage of 1.275V on a Bad Axe (so, I guess my experience is not that unusual).

 

Next, I looked at the XtremeSystems "4 GHz Conroe Club" roster: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=115109

 

Again, Bad Axes do not seem to fair that well here, only two are listed, including an E6600 clocked 4.02 GHz on water. It looks like only one E6300 made 4 GHz and that was on phase. Otherwise, several E6400's in the "4 GHz club" including some on air. The E6600's do well here, the air maximum appears to be about 4.15 GHz.

 

you would need phase change cooling to go above that

 

It looks like air cooling is good to at least 4 GHz and otherwise I have no intention of messing with water, phase or anything else. Furthermore, in both the [H]ardForum and XtremeSystems data the Big Typhoon does quite well. It is clearly the cooling bargain when paired with a high performance fan.

 

MAYBE a 6700 (but they are very expensive) could hit the 4ghz mark, but you would need to get a realy good stepping

 

Bargain hunting, refurbished and spare parts aside, the box I built is probally worth about $1000. Given that an E6600 would only add about $150 to the cost of the total system, I am starting to think it is worth it. That is about 15% higher system cost, given that I would expect to overclock it to near 3.8 GHz, we talking about almost a 20% performance increase plus whatever benefit I would get from cache (which may be nothing or actually quite a bit more than AnandTech's 10% max). However, if the larger cache is not needed, it still is much better to wait for the E4300 (which should clock as high, or perhaps higher due it's smaller die size, as the E6600).

 

btw 333+50% = 499,5*7=3496,50 MHZ

 

Thanks, I fixed that.

 

please also try if you can do the same with 4 memory sticks

 

I certainly will, but I need to attach heatspreaders to my second set of Corair "value" RAM and that takes some time.

[RiceTea]

Given that you manage this thread I suggest to split up again: One for "Building Conroe boxes for OSX86" and another one for "How to OC" these boxes. The OC topic belongs into the "Mods and Overclocking" section. Frankly, building an OC´d Conroe box as noisy as a starting fighter jet does not belong into "The Genius Bar". Overall, this thread is by now pretty much OT and has lost any focus.

 

Here is some data regarding Conroe overclocks. First the [H]ardForum database: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1075...age=1&pp=20

 

Although this data might be a little dated with old steppings, [H]ardforum reports these averages:

 

E6300 :: 3.136

E6400 :: 3.242

E6600 :: 3.384

E6700 :: 3.573

X6800 :: 3.640

 

So, I managed to beat average of the E6300 and E6400 with 3.26 GHz (I could probably squeze out another 50 MHz or so becaue I did not test anything in the 46-49% burn-in range (1333 strap)). But looking over all of the [H]ardForum data, Bad Axes certainly do not appear to be the best boards for maxium overclocking. The best Bad Axe result is by Eva2000 who clocked E6600's to 3.75 GHz. I also notice the Wickedld9 posted an E6300 at the minimum voltage of 1.275V on a Bad Axe (so, I guess my experience is not that unusual).

 

Next, I looked at the XtremeSystems "4 GHz Conroe Club" roster: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=115109

 

Again, Bad Axes do not seem to fair that well here, only two are listed, including an E6600 clocked 4.02 GHz on water. It looks like only one E6300 made to 4 GHz and that was on phase. Otherwise, several E6400's in the "4 GHz club" including some on air. The E6600's fair a little better here.

It looks like air cooling is good to at least 4 GHz and otherwise I have no intention of messing with water, phase or anything else. Furthermore, in both the [H]ardForum and XtremeSystems data the Big Typhoon does quick well. It is clearly the cooling bargain when pair with a high performance fan.

Bargain hunting, refurbished and spare parts aside, the box I built is probally worth about $1000. Given that adding an E6600 would only add about $150 to the cost of the total system, I am starting to think it is worth it. That is about 15% higher system cost, given that I would expect to overclock it to near 3.8 GHz, we talking about almost a 20% performance increase plus whatever benefit I would get from cache (which may be nothing or actually quite a bit more than AnandTech's 10% max). However, if the larger cache is not needed, it still is much better to wait for the E4300 (which should clock as high, or perhaps higher due it's smaller die size, as the E6600)

Thanks, I fixed that.

I certainly will, but I need to attach heatspreaders to my second set of Corair "value" RAM and that takes some time.

[bofors]

Given that you manage this thread I suggest to split up again: One for "Building Conroe boxes for OSX86" and another one for "How to OC" these boxes.

 

I have changed the title specify "overclocking".

 

The OC topic belongs into the "Mods and Overclocking" section. Frankly, building an OC´d Conroe box ... does not belong into "The Genius Bar".

 

Perhaps, but I am going to be working with 10.4.8 and Titan next and reporting those results here. Neither of those topics fit into "Mods and Overclocking".

[joe75]

bofors, dose your ram get to hot, because it seems as though you have big concerns.

 

I didn't think 4.2 was that far-fetched, but I would think 3.8 would be manageable on air

 

I have found, Intel boards dont clock as well as others, thats probably why there were few in the 4 GHz club.

 

Mine will be Asus, and we'll see what I can do

[bofors]

I just installed JaS 10.4.8 (reseed) with really only one snag. I installed the 10.4.4 USB "fix" and that disabled my USB keyboard and mouse. I later that read that the USB "fix" should only be tried if USB fails after the the normal 10.4.8 installation without.

 

So, I reinstalled with no "fixes" whatsoever and selected Mifki's kernel over Semthex's because it seems to be indicated for this setup. I also enabled HPET in BIOS. I was pleasently surprised to see that the old Samsung DVD-ROM I am using (instead of buying a new Pioneer DVR-111) actually boots JaS' installation DVD (it seemed to fail with Myzar's 10.4.5).

 

Networking seems to work "out-of-the-box" but I have yet to even try audio on this machine at all. I seemed to have fixed the clock issue by entering my FSB into com.apple.Boot.plist (in /Library/Preferences/SystemConfiguration) by replacing the empty string for the "Kernel Flag" key with "-v fsb=467" (use <string> </string> tags if editing manually).

 

The 3D Fusion Nvidia 7600GS that I have temporarily installed, until my XFX 7600GS arrives, exhibited something like "mouse tearing" when dragging windows and during scrolling. So, I installed the lasted version (11.04.06) of Omni's Titan kext and now it look like I have full graphics support.

 

Here is the 10.4.8 Mifki kernel Xbench, I gained a few points:

 

Results	225.66	
System Info		
	Xbench Version		1.3
	System Version		10.4.8 (8L2127)
	Physical RAM		2048 MB
	Model		ACPI
	Drive Type		IBM-DTLA-305020
CPU Test	168.93	
	GCD Loop	386.47	20.37 Mops/sec
	Floating Point Basic	185.59	4.41 Gflop/sec
	vecLib FFT	133.77	4.41 Gflop/sec
	Floating Point Library	121.55	21.17 Mops/sec
Thread Test	326.37	
	Computation	299.19	6.06 Mops/sec, 4 threads
	Lock Contention	358.99	15.44 Mlocks/sec, 4 threads
Memory Test	231.98	
	System	236.55	
		Allocate	189.89	697.32 Kalloc/sec
		Fill	263.87	12829.75 MB/sec
		Copy	275.77	5695.91 MB/sec
	Stream	227.59	
		Copy	229.94	4749.22 MB/sec
		Scale	236.95	4895.24 MB/sec
		Add	225.06	4794.18 MB/sec
		Triad	219.16	4688.45 MB/sec

 

I have had no problems with "About This Mac" or anything else crashing (not that I use it, but I did verify that iCal works too), the only thing I noticed so far is this distorted "Software Update" icon:

 

 

After Titan, System Profiler indicates the Nvidia 7600GS I am using is fully support:

 

NVIDIA GeForce 7600 GS:

 Chipset Model:	NVIDIA GeForce 7600 GS
 Type:	Display
 Bus:	PCIe
 VRAM (Total):	256 MB
 Vendor:	NVIDIA (0x10de)
 Device ID:	0x0392
 Revision ID:	0x00a1
 Displays:
SyncMaster:
 Resolution:	1280 x 1024 @ 75 Hz
 Depth:	32-bit Color
 Core Image:	Supported
 Main Display:	Yes
 Mirror:	Off
 Online:	Yes
 Quartz Extreme:	Supported
Display:
 Status:	No display connected

 

Here is the Xbench graphics data:

 

Results	311.29	
System Info		
	Xbench Version		1.3
	System Version		10.4.8 (8L2127)
	Physical RAM		2048 MB
	Model		ACPI
	Drive Type		IBM-DTLA-305020
Quartz Graphics Test	246.90	
	Line	200.12	13.32 Klines/sec [50% alpha]
	Rectangle	257.03	76.74 Krects/sec [50% alpha]
	Circle	247.93	20.21 Kcircles/sec [50% alpha]
	Bezier	223.26	5.63 Kbeziers/sec [50% alpha]
	Text	350.75	21.94 Kchars/sec
OpenGL Graphics Test	242.20	
	Spinning Squares	242.20	307.24 frames/sec
User Interface Test	685.78	
	Elements	685.78	3.15 Krefresh/sec

[casse]

I'm interested in building a system like this myself, and I have a few questions which I think are relevant to the thread topic.

 

1) Would the Bad axe 2 change the overclocking capabilities of the discussed system or is it equal in this regard to the Bad axe 1 with the "oc debug" fix?

 

2) Bofors, you've mentioned it is a requirement for you to be able to run dual displays. I haven't figured out from your reports if you are able to run dual displays with the present setup. If not, is there a way you know of (or in the works) to make it work or have you sacrificed this requirement?

 

3) Will using four ram modules instead of two degrade the dual channel memory performance? I realize this is a general hardware question but I'm getting different answers and two versus four modules is discussed here.

 

On a side note, my own research has led me to favor the Antec Solo case and the Seasonic 430 W power unit.

[bofors]

I'm interested in building a system like this myself, and I have a few questions which I think are relevant to the thread topic.

 

1) Would the Bad axe 2 change the overclocking capabilities of the discussed system or is it equal in this regard to the Bad axe 1 with the "oc debug" fix?

 

The Bad Axe 2 should have significantly improved overclocking abilities: http://www.vr-zone.com/?i=4111

 

Furthermore, it appears that the Bad Axe 2 secondary Marvell 88SE6145 SATA RAID controller may usable with OSx86 (because it is the same chip used in the Highpoint cards):

 

http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?showtopic=24254

http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?sho...mp;hl=highpoint

 

2) Bofors, you've mentioned it is a requirement for you to be able to run dual displays. I haven't figured out from your reports if you are able to run dual displays with the present setup. If not, is there a way you know of (or in the works) to make it work or have you sacrificed this requirement?

 

I expect to have dual displays working soon (perhaps today): http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?sho...=31833&st=0

 

 

3) Will using four ram modules instead of two degrade the dual channel memory performance? I realize this is a general hardware question but I'm getting different answers and two versus four modules is discussed here.

 

It should not effect dual channel performance per se, but may limit memory overclocking which also depends on the size of the memory modules (smaller sticks, like 256MB, overclock better than larger, like 1 GB).

 

I will be testing with 4 x 1GB soon.

 

On a side note, my own research has led me to favor the Antec Solo case and the Seasonic 430 W power unit.

 

Those are fine choices. By the way, Seasonic makes the modular Antec Neo 430W power supply, which is include with the white version of the Solo, the P150. So you might be able to save some money but just buying that instead.