Psystar wins legal round against Apple

Is this good or bad? []

Well, I think most of you guys think evil Psystar shall die, eh?

Opinions vary. I don't like Psystar, personally.

Me too.

i dont know Psystar personally but i have to give them all my support. great work Psystar fight those apple beast. i know you will win just like david slaying goliath the giant. so shall you slay those apple a** holes.

cut there throats and let the dogs lick there blood.

its time a lot of lazy ass people get up off there asses and fight these multimillion corporate thieves.

yes it can be done.

they rob from the poor. they enslave poor third world countries in to making there products.

and pay them dog scaps

yes apple i know all your dirty deeds. scums

i will see the day when a man can buy his computer parts with his money, install what os he feels like. and also sell it . if he feels like for a profit.

who are you to say a man cannot install your os on his pc gears and sell it for a profit. mm? tell me now

did'nt you stole the ipod click weel feature, then add it to your ipod and made a wapping profit.

i know you apple cheese balls scums reads these forums.

long live Psystar am with you all the way. cut the beast throat.

amen

i dont know Psystar personally but i have to give them all my support. great work Psystar fight those apple beast. i know you will win just like david slaying goliath the giant. so shall you slay those apple a** holes.

cut there throats and let the dogs lick there blood.

 

its time a lot of lazy ass people get up off there asses and fight these multimillion corporate thieves.

yes it can be done.

they rob from the poor. they enslave poor third world countries in to making there products.

and pay them dog scaps

yes apple i know all your dirty deeds. scums

i will see the day when a man can buy his computer parts with his money, install what os he feels like. and also sell it . if he feels like for a profit.

 

who are you to say a man cannot install your os on his pc gears and sell it for a profit. mm? tell me now

did'nt you stole the ipod click weel feature, then add it to your ipod and made a wapping profit.

i know you apple cheese balls scums reads these forums.

 

long live Psystar am with you all the way. cut the beast throat.

amen

Question...

If you don't like Apple, what are you doing on a "mac dedicated site" where a bunch of people claim here and there that OSX is one of the best OS created?

Also, having tied their OS to their platform permitted to create a very stable OS, nothing to be compared to MS or linux OSs (having said that, I still use both). You should give them credits for that.

It's not David vs Goliath, it's not good vs bad, it's only buisness.

And if you're pissed off by a mere OS lawsuit, you should check your priorities and begin to have a real relationship with a human being...

By the way, a copyright is the legal tie from an author to his work. If Apple don't work for the other HW manufacturer, it's their buisness and right. Will there be fed agents in the Apple lab the ensure they program their OS for other companies? It would be very unlikely and quite far from the capitalism model of the USA (where I am not living).

P.S.: Apple is not as worse as Nike, every single military corporation and chemical industries without forgetting all these "third world" (expression meaning nothing since the USSR fall, read your political/historical books) companies that are destroying their own countries.

If you don't like the "profit state of mind" of apple, don't argue points like:

"i will see the day when a man can buy his computer parts with his money, install what os he feels like. and also sell it . if he feels like for a profit."

Arguing these points is like throwing rocks to someone because he is throwing rocks, a paradox.

If you want to change this, began to turn from an egoist personnal profit state of mind (which seems to be your case) to a more socialist point of view where you put the personnal motivations in perspective to make clever collective choices. With this egoist state of mind, we have seen the fall of the neo-liberal economic system based on speculation and rapid-profit.

And don't forget that the companies from which you buy your hardware are not known to be "green, pro-third-world, give their money to the poor" companies. They only sell cheaper product because YOU will PAY them for the product, not because they have a kind heart.

Question...

 

If you don't like Apple, what are you doing on a "mac dedicated site" where a bunch of people claim here and there that OSX is one of the best OS created?

yes this is a mac dedicated site. open your eyes do you see people chatting about how to mod there imac g5 or macpro?

this is not about me not liking apple os nore liking apple os. it is about apple corporation on a whole,

who goes around bullying small people with there lawyers and money.

am guessing that you work for apple. well you are one who should go and do some reading. about your beloved apple corporation. read up on the programmers they bribe rob and stole from. pluss other stuff

by the way your member number says 94,880

check mine. ive being on these forum from day one

as i said. long live Psystar am with you all the way. cut the beast throat.

I hope Psystar dies. I would laugh a lot then.

yes this is a mac dedicated site. open your eyes do you see people chatting about how to mod there imac g5 or macpro?

That's why there were marks around my words like that: "mac dedicated site". To point it was not entirely the truth and a figure of meaning.

this is not about me not liking apple os nore liking apple os. it is about apple corporation on a whole,

who goes around bullying small people with there lawyers and money.

am guessing that you work for apple. well you are one who should go and do some reading. about your beloved apple corporation. read up on the programmers they bribe rob and stole from. pluss other stuff

I've never said that Apple was the best or else , it's only buisness and Psystar isn't different at all. So I won't take side for either. If you just want to point that Apple is doing questionnable things, don't forget that Jobs made his first dollars over a phone company back in the 70's, he's a genuis, but also a robber in that way. If you were intending to say that, you've got my support here.

by the way your member number says 94,880

 

 

check mine. ive being on these forum from day one

Yours is 34,713, it's not #1, so for day one... I remember to have seen people joining in 2005... you in 2006.

And this is only a way to kill the messenger, not the message. Kids in the schoolyard argue these points, be mature please.

as i said. long live Psystar am with you all the way. cut the beast throat.

It's your opinion, but as I said earlier, you are only taking side for another company that have in mind to make money over the work of others. No justice is granted here, only continuity.

Anyone may legally challenge Apple, they are free to do so. And to be honest, I don't care. Probably because I'm not a stock owner, but Apple Inc. is the only company on this planet to protect their stuff they way they do.

The world would have been too small if Microsoft would have done the same, and they can, but they chose not to do so. I for one am glad they didn't. And I am sure that most people here either started with some version of Microsoft DOS/Windows, or still use the latter... occasionally.

Microsoft however can't even bundle their browser (Internet Explorer), neither can they bundle their Windows Media Player in Europe, so I wouldn't be surprised when the EU (N. Kroes) steps in and kick Apple in the face, with say a $400 million "invoice" as a reminder. In fact I don't see why they shouldn't... will only be fair to Microsoft.

Lets look at this way; Apple claims that jail-breaking is illegal, throws the DMCA (Digital Millennium Copyright Act) in the ring, because they say that the iPhone may only be used with iTunes and the iTunes store - that must trigger someones attention in Brussel.

In other words; Microsoft cannot bundle their own software while Apple can? That is just ridiculous. Period!

Opinions vary. I don't like Psystar, personally.

I hope Psystar dies. I would laugh a lot then.

I'm personally surprised that Psystar has survived this long. Apple states in their EULA that it's illegal to run, or attempt to run, their OS on non-Apple labeled hardware. I'm even more surprised that Psystar is counter-suing Apple.

I think Psystar is pushing it's luck.

It is obvious that they are violating copyright as they install OSX on the equipment they sell without buying it. If they would have payed for the OSX they have installed for each PC thats an other story....

And I don't have to mention that Psystar also steels and uses the know how accumilated by the osx86 comunity without returning anything positive( except the openhaltrestart.kext )

we all know that Apple has already plans on selling osx for non mac equipment they have been researching this for years and thats why they went for BSD after the classic mac os and thats why we can build hackintoshes and run OSX, so that we can test every equipment inbehalf of Apple for free.

I wouldn't like if apple takes serious measures so that we can never run OSX on any Equipment except mac,

just because of some oppurtinist company like Psystar

At the end of the the day you have to respect Apple for making such a marvelous operation system and buy it if you use it.

I believe that Apple won't give up her marketing model which is totally different from Microsoft. Pursuing being outstanding is the key that Apple possess her extraordinary influence. It's pretty clear that Apple will become another MS if Apple lose the lawsuit and be forced to delete her proviso clause.

Well if Phystar wins Apple doesn't have to make drivers for computers other than theirs. And on their website they can specifically post: Apple only supports OS X on a Mac. Otherwise it might be time to go back to the PPC chipset

Also, having tied their OS to their platform permitted to create a very stable OS, nothing to be compared to MS or linux OSs

How dare you say linux is unstable?

Otherwise it might be time to go back to the PPC chipset

This will never happen...

I'm personally surprised that Psystar has survived this long. Apple states in their EULA that it's illegal to run, or attempt to run, their OS on non-Apple labeled hardware. I'm even more surprised that Psystar is counter-suing Apple.

Apples EULA may be in itself unlawful.

Also it is not criminally illegal to any OS on any platform. It's civil law that *may* be being broken.

I think Psystar is pushing it's luck.

It is obvious that they are violating copyright as they install OSX on the equipment they sell without buying it. If they would have payed for the OSX they have installed for each PC thats an other story....

And I don't have to mention that Psystar also steels and uses the know how accumilated by the osx86 comunity without returning anything positive( except the openhaltrestart.kext )

we all know that Apple has already plans on selling osx for non mac equipment they have been researching this for years and thats why they went for BSD after the classic mac os and thats why we can build hackintoshes and run OSX, so that we can test every equipment inbehalf of Apple for free.

I wouldn't like if apple takes serious measures so that we can never run OSX on any Equipment except mac,

just because of some oppurtinist company like Psystar

At the end of the the day you have to respect Apple for making such a marvelous operation system and buy it if you use it.

IIRC Psystar supplies an original OS X disk with every PC it sells. So wrong on that one!

The OSX86 community uses open source software (with the exception of PC-EFI) so it isn't stealing (technically).

I would be surprised if Apple EVER were going to licence OS X on non Macs. I suspect the intention with Rhapsody was to provide servers on Intel, DEC Alpha and non Apple PowerPC platforms that would connect with Macs. Instead of course, they decided to add connectivity with Windows PCs.

A happy side effect of this was when Macs went Intel, a slight tweak was all that was required to get it working on non Apple hardware, giving us the Hackintosh.

This will never happen...

But if Apple reverted back to PPC processors, wouldn't that kill Psystar and OSx86 because of later releases? Seeing as the whole OSx86 thing started after OS X was ported to Intel for Intel Macs.

Yes. It would. But Apple is committed to Intel processors. They won't go back to PPC.

Snow Leopard is probably already written for Intel only.

I'm for psystar winning on principle, but I don't think it'll be as impactful as it seems. I'd like to see apple selling copies of snow leopard that have a slightly different installer where it can read a usb drive with the drivers/ and run an EFI installation. that way they dont have to do any support, they are selling the actual copy, and it's free for us to do as we need to get whatever it is we have working... but I'm sure I'm over-simplifying it.

gah... win already.

Apples EULA may be in itself unlawful.

 

IIRC Psystar supplies an original OS X disk with every PC it sells. So wrong on that one!

 

The OSX86 community uses open source software (with the exception of PC-EFI) so it isn't stealing (technically).

Well they did not use to give the original OSX disk I think they have started after the law suit.

Psystar also violates EULA... If they would only send the PC and the osx original disk there would be no problem then it would be the customers responsibility if they would violate the EULA...

The know how being developed in the osx86 comunity is not just opensource software but methods like EFIing DSDTing ment for home enthusiasts but not for making easy bucks on other peoples hard work without giving credit. As you have mentioned above Psystar did steel Netkas' work without permission thats why netkas does not release the source for the new PCEFIv9

How dare you say linux is unstable?

I dare by personnal experience, with more than 3 different hardware setup, I've tried, for exemple, Ubuntu 7.04 to 8.10. Each time, either a component, ACPI or even GUI rendering wasn't perfect. I also experience program crashing from time to time. That said, it's not dramatic and continuous support fix a lot of problems. I still think that Linux project as a whole is a very good thing, I couldn't use my computer without it, it's more reliable than MS and safer vs malware of any sort.

I didn't wanted to upset you, but you should admit that in each great project, like Linux, there are always flaws. Nothing is perfect.

Maybe I should use another distro, but my experience is that one.

Well they did not use to give the original OSX disk I think they have started after the law suit.

Psystar also violates EULA... If they would only send the PC and the osx original disk there would be no problem then it would be the customers responsibility if they would violate the EULA...

The know how being developed in the osx86 comunity is not just opensource software but methods like EFIing DSDTing ment for home enthusiasts but not for making easy bucks on other peoples hard work without giving credit. As you have mentioned above Psystar did steel Netkas' work without permission thats why netkas does not release the source for the new PCEFIv9

They are questioning the legality of the EULA tho.

The point is, with one exception (EFI) the computer is the same as a standard PC. Psystar are trying to prove that. The argument is by restricting the EULA conditions to Apple labelled hardware that is to all intents and purposes the same as non apple labelled, Apple artificially creating a monopoly and making users pay a premium price for what is in effect the same hardware just with an Apple badge, to use its software.

Apple has 2 options if they lose

One - Abandon Intel architecture - Apple's purchase of PA Semiconductor *might* mean just that. The reports of them being used to make Super ARM chips for the iPhone could just be a smokescreen.

Two - Open OS X to all Intel based PCs.

I'm also sure Psystar always supplied an original disk.

EDIT: I don't support Psystar tho, OSX86 should remain a hobby not a business.

They are questioning the legality of the EULA tho.

 

The point is, with one exception (EFI) the computer is the same as a standard PC. Psystar are trying to prove that. The argument is by restricting the EULA conditions to Apple labelled hardware that is to all intents and purposes the same as non apple labelled, Apple artificially creating a monopoly and making users pay a premium price for what is in effect the same hardware just with an Apple badge, to use its software.

This point is critical. But think of it, Apple has always sold "unique" machines bundled with an "unique" OS. It is a bundle, a monolithic product, with the option to upgrade the software in it.

Don't overlook this, they do not block people to install other software in their machines (like Linux or Windoze), they provide tools for it, so it could be hard to talk about monoply system to use only their software on their hardware.

Then, it remains the "OS upgrade" feature, they create OS for their own products, with a limited backward compatibility. They provide warranty and support for only their product and "prohibit" installing their OS on other machines. If they lose the "prohibit" part in court, they will certainly push harder on the "their product" part and create more and more different machines in the future. They had peace in mind with PPC, "no one" was using that. Now they will use hardware dirty tricks to block people from installing and running their OS. When pushed in the corner, anybody can be very nasty.

This could take the form of a very different video hardware, a vital part of their OS with the upcomming OpenCL feature in Snow Leopard or a new propriatary WiFi/Ethernet interface (isolating clones to their basement) or anything else. Even maybe customized CPU or chipset, this could be very nasty from them. They will need time to do so, so there will be a long court saga to let them prepare.

Installing OSX will be harder and harder, not impossible, but harder enough to keep people to make money on their back easily.

Also, as pointed by Chris Mills,

The point is, with one exception (EFI) the computer is the same as a standard PC. Psystar are trying to prove that.

if they can prove that their new computer are more different than standard PC, then the legality of their claim will be OK. So they may loose with Leopard, but in the upcomming Snow Leopard, the same mistakes could be avoided by selling more different computers.

Intel >>> PPC...which is why Apple finally moved over to Intel... performance, heat, and number of cores were the big reasons