Macbook Pro vs Samsung X60

[bigboss]

I was just browsing the net looking for a new laptop as I'm selling off my 4 year old P4M 1.7GHz. Initially, I thought Macbook Pro all the way but like most hardware, its damned expensive... Anyways, to cut a long story short, I found the Samsung X60. Like the MB, it comes with a Radeon X1600, its 5.5lb, 23.9mm thick, and very sleek. It comes with its own media center like program (FRONT ROW SUCKS!) and its got a very nice looking PCIMCIA remote which kills the apple remote.

 

http://www.samsungcomputer.com/product/X60...tm?SMSESSION=NO

 

Where it beats a Macbook:

- It supports 1680x1050 whereas the MB can only do 1440x900 and I like screen real estate.

- The remote has greater functionality

- The charging battery monitor

- Lots of media buttons

- Its got 4 speakers

- It uses the SATA interface as opposed to ATA-6, I realize that right now it may not seem as much of an issue but 4 years down the line, it will be and future-proofing is a big thing.

 

I know that with a Macbook Pro you can use bootcamp and get 100% (more or less) Windows compatibility but this laptop seems to better than a Macbook pro (in my opinion). I want to do Video/DVD/editing/making, gaming, general word processing, some coding etc. so it will be a general purpose desktop replacement. Tell me what you guys think.

 

Thanks

[jonajona]

Wow.... the Samsung looks way better. And if you're gonna do some coding... i'll stick with windows. I really believe that Vista is the next big OS. (Can't wait for it to come out). The MacBook looks slick but so does the Samsung. However, the MacBook comes with a built-in iSight. Nevertheless, i'll go with the Samsung if I were you. Do you know where to buy it or how much it costs?

[bigboss]

Wow.... the Samsung looks way better. And if you're gonna do some coding... i'll stick with windows. I really believe that Vista is the next big OS. (Can't wait for it to come out). The MacBook looks slick but so does the Samsung. However, the MacBook comes with a built-in iSight. Nevertheless, i'll go with the Samsung if I were you. Do you know where to buy it or how much it costs?

 

Haha I agree, if Microsoft kills some legacy support for Vista, it will be a big hit. For the laptop, unfortunately, I dont think its available for sale in North America as the only sellers were in the UK. Im guessing that it should start to sell in the US market soon (hopefully ). For coding, Windows is definitely better than OS X. Also, if I really want (which I do ) I can install OS X on it and it should more or less have full support most likely with the exception of Intel wireless (if it uses Intel wireless).

 

Anyways, here are some UK sites that sell it : http://shopping.zdnet.co.uk/0,39033135,29022447,00.htm

 

Ofcourse, do expect it to be more expensive in Europe (they just love tax and killing foreign competition, dont they )

[slipstream]

I was just browsing the net looking for a new laptop as I'm selling off my 4 year old P4M 1.7GHz. Initially, I thought Macbook Pro all the way but like most hardware, its damned expensive... Anyways, to cut a long story short, I found the Samsung X60. Like the MB, it comes with a Radeon X1600, its 5.5lb, 23.9mm thick, and very sleek. It comes with its own media center like program (FRONT ROW SUCKS!) and its got a very nice looking PCIMCIA remote which kills the apple remote.

 

http://www.samsungcomputer.com/product/X60...tm?SMSESSION=NO

 

Where it beats a Macbook:

- It supports 1680x1050 whereas the MB can only do 1440x900 and I like screen real estate.

- The remote has greater functionality

- The charging battery monitor

- Lots of media buttons

- Its got 4 speakers

- It uses the SATA interface as opposed to ATA-6, I realize that right now it may not seem as much of an issue but 4 years down the line, it will be and future-proofing is a big thing.

 

I know that with a Macbook Pro you can use bootcamp and get 100% (more or less) Windows compatibility but this laptop seems to better than a Macbook pro (in my opinion). I want to do Video/DVD/editing/making, gaming, general word processing, some coding etc. so it will be a general purpose desktop replacement. Tell me what you guys think.

 

Thanks

 

I am quite disappointed with osx on an intel box.. it is not that fast compared to a real Intel Mac... My powerbook seems alot snapper than a P4 2.4ghz with a highend ati card and quartz extreme running. and the powerbook is 2 years old!

 

so more buttons on a remote are suppose to be better ? Thats not the way Apple works

the extra res on that size screen means u would need a microscope to see it and that card can do higher res on external monitors so it is a non issue. I wonder what the quality of the screen is like though. Unless u can get one side by side you wont really know and I suggest u go look at both.

the charging monitor.. osx displays it on the screen and also if u want to see it when the system is off then there is a little button to show u on the bottom of my powerbook and looking at the system u are looking at it is a direct MaC Ripoff but uglier!

Have us seen the software that comes with this PC laptop ? how do u know it is better than frontrow? there is freeware for the mac that u may prefer that has a few more options than frontrow like IP tv feeds.

i also was certain that macbook pros use SATA drivers heck even the mini does!

of course u get all the extra apple software and it just works.

so if u want to run windows only get the other system if u want to run osx or/and windows get the macbook pro for sure and of course then there is parrallels u run windows app inside OSX none of this seems to work on a non apple box ..so some things work but not all and it never seems to run anywhere as well for some reason.

look about most of these guys do this on their white box and then buy a mini or MBPro

I have had fun on my non apple box but i am way happier on my powerbook even if it is old and cant wait to get a real MBPro I am waiting 6 months for the merom chip though..

 

figure what u want but if u really want to use OSX pay the bit extra and get a real Mac.. you wont regret it in the long run.. image windows xp OSX , Vista all running side by side and very fast abd stable there are heaps of articles telling u that windows run fast and very stable on a mac and that people like cringlley are recommeding windows users that need a fast stable windows system to by a mbpro. I think thats says alot really

[Baal]

I am quite disappointed with osx on an intel box.. it is not that fast compared to a real Intel Mac... My powerbook seems alot snapper than a P4 2.4ghz with a highend ati card and quartz extreme running. and the powerbook is 2 years old!

 

There are a number of reasons for this. Firstly, your P4 does not support SSE3 (I'm assuming since it's a 2.4 GHz) so it has to be emulated through SSE2. Secondly alot of applications are not yet Universal so they must run through rosetta. Most importantly, there aren't any official graphics drivers and most of those cards that do work are using a driver that was only created on a temporary basis for the dev machines, are beta and incomplete.

 

If you were to get the exact hardware OSX currently supports in full, ie a Core Duo processor, Intel based motherboard and a Radeon X1600 the os would run much faster and without any problems. This has been the biggest difference between Apple computers and PC based, the former has proprietory hardware and software while the latter supports the widest range possible.

 

 

As for the question, the X60 does indeed look very nice; it has more features and supports a much wider range of software. OSX should run quite well on it also, close to or even as fast as it does on the macbook.

[slipstream]

There are a number of reasons for this. Firstly, your P4 does not support SSE3 (I'm assuming since it's a 2.4 GHz) so it has to be emulated through SSE2. Secondly alot of applications are not yet Universal so they must run through rosetta. Most importantly, there aren't any official graphics drivers and most of those cards that do work are using a driver that was only created on a temporary basis for the dev machines, are beta and incomplete.

 

If you were to get the exact hardware OSX currently supports in full, ie a Core Duo processor, Intel based motherboard and a Radeon X1600 the os would run much faster and without any problems. This has been the biggest difference between Apple computers and PC based, the former has proprietory hardware and software while the latter supports the widest range possible.

As for the question, the X60 does indeed look very nice; it has more features and supports a much wider range of software. OSX should run quite well on it also, close to or even as fast as it does on the macbook.

 

SSE3 only makes a difference for rossetta just read around the board. It just doesnt run as snappy even with an expensive card with quartzx extreme

I only use universal apps.. i steer clear of rossetta..

well i beat it never runs as well as a real apple system for osx you will be fiddling to get updates I find alot of stuff just doesnt work unless it is an exact replica. and what with the EFI and remebering the hardware may look the same but Mac has it's own firmware on stuff like video cards. all the time spent to get windows running was the drivers and apple brings them out and everything works sweet thats what u will continually fight with in the future

How does that system support a wider range of software.. osx plus xp plus vista plus linux on the MBpro remember. Time will tell I am sure it sounds like u where convinced before u posted but i am sure in the long run if u want osx to run then it will be a lot easier with a real Mac.. BTW how much cheaper is this than a mbpro anywahy I am not familiar with the pricing. I am also wondering about the screen most new laptops have those shiney bright refelective screens which I hate.. they look horrible I cant stand them

best of luck anyway i am sure you will be having alot of fun on it and you'll get osx running ok though not perfect but maybe it will do what u need which is really all that matters isn't it

just read this

WWDC takes placed between August 7-11th of this year.

be one of the first to preview Mac OS X Leopard. You’ll get the chance to explore the latest Mac tools and technologies, and to learn the advances that are keeping Mac OS X far, far ahead of the competition.

 

I wonder what our systmes will do with Leopard. I have a feeling it may blow vista away with some new features like virtuaization but maybe not

 

cheers

[chick]

Haha I agree, if Microsoft kills some legacy support for Vista, it will be a big hit. For the laptop, unfortunately, I dont think its available for sale in North America as the only sellers were in the UK. Im guessing that it should start to sell in the US market soon (hopefully ). For coding, Windows is definitely better than OS X. Also, if I really want (which I do ) I can install OS X on it and it should more or less have full support most likely with the exception of Intel wireless (if it uses Intel wireless).

 

Anyways, here are some UK sites that sell it : http://shopping.zdnet.co.uk/0,39033135,29022447,00.htm

 

Ofcourse, do expect it to be more expensive in Europe (they just love tax and killing foreign competition, dont they )

 

Could you tell me why Windows is definitely better than OSX for coding ?

 

There's nothing better than an *nix environment for coding, IMO. You have the GNU compilers and tools, you have a terminal, powerful command line programs...

 

You don't like Front Row, you don't like the macbook, you don't like OSX. Why do you consider buying a MBP ?

[alc0h0lic]

Exactly. Using OS X for 2 years now as a workstation for software development and it's great. The only thing that keeps me still booting my windows pc is Visual Studio 2005.

 

I would go for the MBP considering that OS X Leopard will add more value to it than Vista will do to the X60.

[suleiman]

The biggest arguments for buying the MacBook Pro are that you get an ExpressCard slot whereas with the Samsung you get a PCMCIA slot.

 

The drive on the MBP is a SATA, not an ATA-6 as far as I know.

 

The remote also controls Keynote presentations in addition to frontrow, and is compatible with other software like Equinox's Media Central also.

 

The iSight is missing on the X60, and that does come in handy on a notebook, but I'll admit it is a bit of a novelty item. The X60 also lacks an illuminated keyboard.

 

Remember too that running a hacked OS X on your X60 will come nowhere close to the level of compatibility you'll be getting from your MacBook Pro. You will not be able to free-finger scroll, a feature I have truly grown to love, and getting things like graphics and the rest to work fully functionally will be a challenge and a hassle.

 

But in all fairness, the X60 does sport more screen real estate, a higher RAM threshold (3GB instead of 2GB), and better speakers.

 

I would still go for the MBP, mainly because being able to run both OS's in 100% compatibility mode is a feature that can't be leveraged on any machine other than an Apple. :censored2:

[bigboss]

Could you tell me why Windows is definitely better than OSX for coding ? :censored2:

 

There's nothing better than an *nix environment for coding, IMO. You have the GNU compilers and tools, you have a terminal, powerful command line programs...

 

You don't like Front Row, you don't like the macbook, you don't like OSX. Why do you consider buying a MBP ?

 

I think the Macbook Pro looks amazing, I think OS X is a much better OS than Windows XP but as for Windows Vista, I cant comment. I dont like Front Row because it seems like a cheap ripoff of Windows Media Center. Also, almost all my coding is done on Visual Studio 2005.

 

I like the additional features of the Samsung X60 and the lack of the iSight camera doesnt seem to be much of an issue for me. I'd like a laptop that is fully compatible with both OS X and Windows but I realize that currently the only laptop which can do that is the Macboko Pro. I'm trying to decide if the additional features of the X60 are more important than having full OS X compatibility.

 

Ofcourse, overall it seems that while the X60 has more eye candy value to it than the X60, the Macbook Pro will probably add more value since I can run both XP and OS X with full compatibility.

 

Thanks for all your opinions btw.

[dponmac]

SSE3 only makes a difference for rossetta just read around the board. It just doesnt run as snappy even with an expensive card with quartzx extreme

I only use universal apps.. i steer clear of rossetta..

so what are you using? like 5 programs?! :censored2:

 

Honestly, after the release of Boot Camp, I'm pretty much set on getting a MacBook Pro, sure you can do the same thing with the samsung, but I gauruntee things will run a lot more smoothly running bootcamp on a MBP. Plus, theres no waiting for someone to crack the next release, and who knows whats going to happen in the Hackintosh world once Leopard is released.

 

If you're planning on using XP only, then go with the samsung. If you're planning on doing a OSX/ XP dual boot,(which I'm assuming you are since you're posting in this forum) go with a MBP.

[slipstream]

so what are you using? like 5 programs?!

 

Honestly, after the release of Boot Camp, I'm pretty much set on getting a MacBook Pro, sure you can do the same thing with the samsung, but I gauruntee things will run a lot more smoothly running bootcamp on a MBP. Plus, theres no waiting for someone to crack the next release, and who knows whats going to happen in the Hackintosh world once Leopard is released.

 

If you're planning on using XP only, then go with the samsung. If you're planning on doing a OSX/ XP dual boot,(which I'm assuming you are since you're posting in this forum) go with a

MBP.

 

as of 2 weeks ago there was 1300 apps for Mac that are universl..

I have a feed of intel universal updates for the mac and it averages abour 15 -20 a day

so no there are tons of unioversal apps and at that rate 99% of the stuff will be UV in a few months

 

Have you tried parrallels ? it doens seem to work on my intel box but i here it is fantastic on a real mac intel..

[dponmac]

Well I'm still holding my breath for Reason Adobe CS and Cubase to be unibin and thats not gonna happen till '07.. guess only programs that matter to me are in the 1% bracket...

[ejmlab]

I recently purchased a samsung x60 and currently have a dual boot with osx 10.4.4 (with .4.5 upgrade) and winxp. I bought the notebook as a replacement for my toshiba 5200 (P4m 2.0 ghz) that I've owned for about 3.5 years. I use my notebook computer for a variety of relatively intensive tasks in a production environment and the Toshiba 5200 was laboring under CS2 (Indesign, Illustrator, and Photoshop concurrently).

 

The X60 handles CS2 quite smoothly under both winxp and osx although the edge certainly goes to winxp since the it's running native code. But even under Rosetta I can comfortably use Indesign and do some tweaking with photoshop.

 

As for osx on the X60 I can say it was pretty straight forward. The main issue I had was that osx doesn't have driver support for audio. It's unfortunate because the x60 has a nice high-def audio setup. The solution for me (for the time being) was to buy a cheap set of usb speakers. Voila! sound output within osx. The display runs nicely (I modified the display settings to 1440x900x32) but osx reset it to 1152x864x32. It's an offbeat resolution but it looks very good on the 15.4 inch screen. There is a bit of mouse tearing that occurs when I use the mouse scroll so I'm training myself to use the scroll bars or scroll on unimportant areas of the screen...anyways it's pretty minor stuff. There is the odd remnant when you move the mouse but it's not a big deal.

 

Now as for this comment

well i beat it never runs as well as a real apple system for osx you will be fiddling to get updates I find alot of stuff just doesnt work unless it is an exact replica

I can say that it's true that not everything works exactly as it would on a Mac but this is not a difficult install. Anyone, with even the most tertiary linux experience will have no problem with working with the .kexts and manuevering around within osx. The shocking thing for me, since the introduction of osx, is that apple would move towards a *nix based system when their bread and butter customers want absolutely nothing to do with anything "under the hood". I think it's safe to say that more windows users will be willing and able to take the plunge on dual booting osx and winxp despite the fact that mactel hardware would provide for a much 'easier' dual boot experence. Perhaps theres something to the sentiment that "anything worth having is worth working for."

 

Cheers

 

PS: The attached picture was taken with my fuji finepix which I just plugged into the x60 running osx and modified using photoshop cs2.

[bigboss]

Thanks for posting ejmlab, I was wondering what kind of driver support the X60 had, its good to know that almost everything is supported with the exception of sound and wireless (using Intel 3945). I guess that the only thing people need then is someone to code a working Intel HD Audio driver and a wireless driver which are both fairly widely used pieces of hardware. Hopefully with the release of omni's framebuffer and new driver set, you will be able to eliminate the tearing and take full advantage of the 1680x1050 resolution.

 

PS: What are the specs on your laptop and do you have any dual-core stuttering (pretty easy to fix but I'm just wondering )

 

Thanks once again!

[ejmlab]

@bigboss

 

I have the T2400 version of the x60:

 

Here's the Hardware Overview (as OSX see's it in system profiler):

 

Machine Name: Apple Development Platform

Machine Model: ADP2,1

CPU Type: Genuine Intel® CPU T2400 @

Number Of CPUs: 2

CPU Speed: 1.83 GHz

L2 Cache (per CPU): 2 MB

CPU Features: FPU VME DE PSE TSC MSR PAE MCE CX8 APIC SEP MTRR PGE MCA CMOV PAT CLFSH DS ACPI MMX FXSR SSE SSE2 SS HTT TM EST

Memory: 1 GB

Bus Speed: 100 MHz

Boot ROM Version: 06XA (Phoenix Technologies LTD)

 

The core duo processors are working fine with no stuttering and all of the display effects (ie. dock and animations) are snappy and leave no remnants. The mouse is the culprit for leaving remnants and tearing. Outside of having no wifi, and no audio support pretty much everything else seems to work. I've burned CD's using Toast although I haven't tried to burn a DVD yet. I'll test dvd burning later today. Yesterday I connected to my home network to share files via SAMBA and share our network printer (clp-500 color laser) and it all worked flawlessly. I'm running the VLC for mactel to watch vids and that worked great too. DVD works for playback and even the remote control that came with the x60 works within osx.

 

Again, it's not a perfect system and so I wouldn't recommend it to someone who really wants a Macbook Pro. The samsung x60 is not a substitute for the macbook despite the fact that the hardware is strikingly similar. For me the real benefit of dual booting is that when I get home from the office I can change OS's and get out of my work space for a few hours of down time.

 

Cheers

[sheriffbounce]

one short question: how did you get the x1600 ati running?

do u have QE/CI?????

[Colonel]

I don't care what the other guy has. If i were you, I would get the Macbook Pro. It has all supported hardware and you don't have to worry about waiting for another cracked OS to upgrade it.

[slipstream]

i just bought a alesis multimix which is a little mixer that is suppose to work in 10.4.6 but it does on a powerpc but not of 10.4.6 under and intel box.. it is these sorts of little pains in the butt that are the problem with non Apple I was very careful to talk to the manufacterers first but it seems that 10.4.6 on non apple hardware is missing some stuff unfortunately.

1 thing i am concerned about is when leopard comes out.. I am still very happy with OSX on an PC system especially with apps like Ableton Live 5.2 running great and it will get better as companies release new drivers.. Actually I have run Cubase under Rosetta and it at least played stuff back perfectly in time no worries.

It really comes down to trying to guess and plan for the future both of the hardware and software and thats impossible. running on anything that is not Apple hardware is never going to be dead easy or perfect but I think most of us definitly get that after a while and are willing to put up with the little issues. Especially if you are a power user of windows as we are use to getting under the hood. The beauty of the Apple stuff is it gives one a lot more boring life. Some people want this others dont worry about it at all. I still use my powerbook to get stuff done hassle free but muck about with my PC box with OSX and windows on it when I want a bit more of a challenge. I happen to love the feeling of sorting a hassle out and getting it working.

[Jeezoflip]

i knew samsung made hardware and stuff, but i never knew they attempted the computer industry its self.

[ejmlab]

Update:

 

Just thought I'd post an update regarding burner support on the x60. I have the Teac dv-w28ea. OSX recognizes it and indicates the formats it's able to burn (dvd +/-r, dvd-ram, ...) Yesterday I burned data to a dvd-r using Toast. I burned using the disk-at-once option. Cheers

 

PS

 

@colonels1020

 

I don't care what the other guy has. If i were you, I would get the Macbook Pro.

 

my intent on posting information regarding an OSX install on the samsung x60 was to add information to the discussion. Hopefully this information will help others make an informed decision regarding osx on the x60.

 

@jeezoflip

 

samsung is a huge player in the domestic korean computer systems market but from what I understand their presence internationally is quite small.

[ralleria]

I've got a MacBook Pro, after having an Ibook G4 and a Powermac G5. I wouldn't advise it, it has several problems: whine, heat, etc. My iBook G4 was just perfect compared to the MacBook Pro.

The quality control is pure {censored}. I'm sorry to say that but it is the truth. Now just few words on the display: brighter doesn't mean better, sony displays are a far better alternative and maybe Samsung as well.

 

I've always been a mac user and I'm seriously considering to buy a PC notebook with OS X on it.

I've spent over 2600€ to get a notebook, money that I've earned during this year.....but I'm thinking about selling it. I've sent it for a repair and I'm waiting for it if it doesn't satisfy me I'll sell it.

[felixding]

WWDC takes placed between August 7-11th of this year.

be one of the first to preview Mac OS X Leopard. You’ll get the chance to explore the latest Mac tools and technologies, and to learn the advances that are keeping Mac OS X far, far ahead of the competition.

 

I wonder what our systmes will do with Leopard. I have a feeling it may blow vista away with some new features like virtuaization but maybe not

 

cheers

 

Yes, I fully agree your opinion: Leopard will keep Jobs far, far ahead of the competition in bragging.

Remember, never ever try to start a nosense flame war please, most of the ppl here are geeks, and they know the inner working.

[EtherealRemnant]

I am quite disappointed with osx on an intel box.. it is not that fast compared to a real Intel Mac... My powerbook seems alot snapper than a P4 2.4ghz with a highend ati card and quartz extreme running. and the powerbook is 2 years old!

 

Your experience with your Intel chip is MUCH different than my experience with my AMD chip.

 

You have to understand that the P4 is nowhere NEAR the most optimized chip in existence. Its a dead platform and its just not efficient enough to run OS X effectively without insane clock speeds. My Athlon 64 @ 2.2GHz will kick your P4 so hard that its silicon will explode into vapor. This chip kicks the living {censored} out of the Intel Macs in everything from boot time to application performance unless you start talking about running multiple processes (which honestly, it STILL performs extremely well under OS X with multi-tasking). I bumped the clock up to 2.75GHz and I must say that this system is perfect for running OS X. All that I need is QE and CI support and I'm set.

 

Its funny that I hear more people with Intel chips complaining about OS X performance than those with AMD. Sure, we need a {censored} ton of patches but I think that also has to do with the fact that it must be embarrassing to have hackintoshes running OS X on AMD and outperforming the retail Intel offering by a big stretch.

 

Now if they'd kick the Core Duo to 2.6GHz or more, AMD would have some serious competition. At 2.6GHz, the Core Duo murders AMD's entire line (including the FX-60) in just about every way.

 

Your Powerbook is snappier because your Intel chip doesn't cut the mustard.

 

BTW, I run Parallels on my AMD64 and the performance blows my mind, even without Vanderpool extensions. When running Windows XP, its at LEAST 30% faster than VMWare is. It actually runs SLOWER under Windows than it does over OS X. Not too shabby for a beta product.

[bigboss]

Now if they'd kick the Core Duo to 2.6GHz or more, AMD would have some serious competition. At 2.6GHz, the Core Duo murders AMD's entire line (including the FX-60) in just about every way.

 

Actually, the Core Duo at 2.16 GHz can still kill the AMD FX-60...