God botherers, I want your opinions.

[Maxintosh]

Who is denying that there are many similarities in ancient middle eastern stories?

Great, glad you agree. Next...

 

It does seem like there was a big movement during second temple Judaism to write it all down

Yes, but keep in mind that back then very few people knew how to write. Many parts of the bible were written by the same person, even though they were penned as coming from different people. Big difference. But we are getting slightly off topic as none of this has anything to do with God and/or free will.

[JonTheSavage]

I propose that one's lack of understanding, and lack of ability to explain God, doesn't mean that he doesn't exist. I just means that in the heathern mind he doesn't exist.

 

Just because there are balls of lights in the sky does not mean they are all stars, or planets.

 

Man can't even explain the universe, much less his own planet, what makes the heathern mind think they can say God doesn't exist?

 

Sounds more like arrogance, and self love to me.

[Running With Scissors]

Religion was created by rulers and peoples peers to control the population through the ultimate fear. Hey behave or you will go to hell where bad things will happen.

 

It was believed by common people out of desperation and despair they wanted to think their was a paradise waiting for them after the {censored} life it was back then.

 

If god was real why is the war, people killing and raping children. How do you explain evolution if we are created in gods image?

[JonTheSavage]

Religion was created by rulers and peoples peers to control the population through the ultimate fear. Hey behave or you will go to hell where bad things will happen.

 

It was believed by common people out of desperation and despair they wanted to think their was a paradise waiting for them after the {censored} life it was back then.

 

If god was real why is the war, people killing and raping children. How do you explain evolution if we are created in gods image?

 

Heh. Sounds more like global warming. Fear to keep uneducated idiots under control.

 

How do you explain evolution? Please explain.

If I throw a Ford into a junk yard, and come back 1,000 years later, will it turn into a Volvo?

 

Since you cannot explain the universe, and since you cannot explain the existance of matter, even though you believe it cannot be created, nor destroyed, you have created a pardox in your mind that you yourself, cannot comprehend.

[Running With Scissors]

Heh. Sounds more like global warming. Fear to keep uneducated idiots under control.

 

How do you explain evolution? Please explain.

If I throw a Ford into a junk yard, and come back 1,000 years later, will it turn into a Volvo?

 

Since you cannot explain the universe, and since you cannot explain the existance of matter, even though you believe it cannot be created, nor destroyed, you have created a pardox in your mind that you yourself, cannot comprehend.

 

Your not making any sense.

 

WTF has a ford or a volvo for that matter got to do with evolution. Evolution is the reason why you walk on two legs, have two eyes and dont live in the sea. Not wether a ford can be RECYCLED in to a volvo.

 

Your last paragraph looks like a quote from DR Who.

[Maxintosh]

Religion was created by rulers and peoples peers to control the population through the ultimate fear. Hey behave or you will go to hell where bad things will happen.

Shhhhhh.... quiet, don't let the 'secret' out or when you die all of those virgins waiting for you will be fat

 

If god was real why is the war, people killing and raping children.

Because some people are scumbags and good people don't do anything to stop them. God has nothing to do with the equation.

[JonTheSavage]

Your not making any sense.

WTF has a ford or a volvo for that matter got to do with evolution. Evolution is the reason why you walk on two legs, have two eyes and dont live in the sea. Not wether a ford can be RECYCLED in to a volvo.

Your last paragraph looks like a quote from DR Who.

 

No. Im saying, that since your religion is evolution, then explain your religion to me. Explain how it works.

[Running With Scissors]

Do you really need me to explain evolution to you? Okay.

 

In biology, evolution is the changes seen in the inherited traits of a population from one generation to the next. These changes cause populations of organisms to alter over time. Inherited traits come from the genes that are passed on to offspring during reproduction. Mutations in genes can produce new or altered traits, resulting in the appearance of heritable differences between organisms. Such new traits also come from the transfer of genes between populations, as in migration, or between species, in horizontal gene transfer. Evolution occurs when these heritable differences become more common or rare in a population, either non-randomly through natural selection or randomly through genetic drift.

 

In other words evolution is when helpful mutations that enable species to hunt or reproduce (to survive better) become more common through reproduction and the bad mutations dont because the individuals dont survive.

Natural Selection in other words.

[JonTheSavage]

Do you really need me to explain evolution to you? Okay.

 

In other words evolution is when helpful mutations that enable species to hunt or reproduce (to survive better) become more common through reproduction and the bad mutations dont because the individuals dont survive.

Natural Selection in other words.

 

So what came first? The chicken or the egg?

 

I don't dismiss Natural Selection. I just want to know which came first to the above question involving the process.

[Running With Scissors]

That is my point if god made man in his own image. How do you explain Evolution?

Or is god a microorganism?

[JonTheSavage]

That is my point if god made man in his own image. How do you explain Evolution?

Or is god a microorganism?

 

That can be answered by reading the book of Ecclesiastes, which I quoted the answer in another topic. A topic of someone mentioning the death of his beloved pet.

 

Then how did the micro-organism come into being? Explain.

 

Which brings me back to my earlier statement.

If I leave a Ford in a spot, and come back 1,000 years later, will it evolve into a volvo?

[Running With Scissors]

Like most bible bashers your ignoring the nonsense in the bible.

God created man in his image. False, Evolution

God created the earth in a week False, Evolution again

Noah's Arc How do you fit every animal on a boat

[Maxintosh]

So what came first? The chicken or the egg?

Genetic material does not change during an animal's life so the egg in one form or another had to have come first, since the living organism inside the eggshell would have had the same DNA as the chicken it would develop into.

Noah's Arc How do you fit every animal on a boat

Not only that but how do you keep them from eating one another... and more importantly, who had the job of cleaned up all of their manure

[JonTheSavage]

Genetic material does not change during an animal's life so the egg in one form or another had to have come first, since the living organism inside the eggshell would have had the same DNA as the chicken it would develop into.Not only that but how do you keep them from eating one another... and more importantly, who had the job of cleaned up all of their manure

 

That didn't explain the existance of the first cell.

 

Chicken manure is a mess.

Good fertalizer though.

 

Like most bible bashers your ignoring the nonsense in the bible.God created man in his image. False, EvolutionGod created the earth in a week False, Evolution againNoah's Arc How do you fit every animal on a boat

 

You are saying that evolution is the answer to your opposition, although you cannot explain your stance. Maybe you can explain evolution since that is what you believe.

[Running With Scissors]

Im pretty sure your almighty god didn't just create one cell and hope for the best, did he?

 

Im not saying evolution is the answer im just saying it casts serious doubt on most bible theories.

[JonTheSavage]

Im pretty sure your almighty god didn't just create one cell and hope for the best, did he?

 

My work here is done.

[Running With Scissors]

/sarcasm

[JonTheSavage]

/sarcasm

 

[Running With Scissors]

anyway bed for me.

looks like ill have to prove you wrong tomorrow

good night and whatever bless

[socal swimmer]

hahahaah

 

that was funny

 

Jon you are ignoring his points. you asked him to explain evolution the post after he did.

 

And the whole problem of first cause (where did the first cell come from? where did matter come from?) is vastly larger with god. not only must he come from somewhere, but he is hugely complex. At least everything else follows laws.

 

 

 

And there is the possibility that the bible is simply a metaphor, not meant to be taken literally but merely as a guide for how to live your life. I think this is the most intelligent interpretation, aside from outright dismissal of it.

[QuietOC]

God created man in his image. False, EvolutionGod created the earth in a week False, Evolution againNoah's Arc How do you fit every animal on a boat

Are these objections about the Bible or someone's opinion about the Bible?

 

Genesis is not the only middle eastern account of a big flood. Likely this flood could have been the creation of the Mediterrean Sea. For someone living in this area this would have been a universal flood. It doesn't matter that the some mountain on the moon didn't get completely submerged, for example.

 

The Bible clearly states the creation week is still in process--we haven't gotten to God's Sabbath rest yet (Saturday).

 

While certain (mainly modern western) views about the Bible haven't held up very well, neither have most historic theories of macro evolution.

And the whole problem of first cause (where did the first cell come from? where did matter come from?) is vastly larger with god. not only must he come from somewhere, but he is hugely complex. At least everything else follows laws.

Where did the laws come from? Why is there math? God is normally thought of as the greatest possible being. You should ask if space-time can fulfill this, if so maybe that is a good answer.

 

I do not see "first cause" being at all compelling. First, "first" implies an unrealistic view of time.

 

And there is the possibility that the bible is simply a metaphor, not meant to be taken literally but merely as a guide for how to live your life.

No, the Bible is meaningless as a metaphor. Yes, it is contains metaphors, but it also contains  a wide variety of literature. I believe that it is true literature, even the fictional stories (Jesus liked to use fiction). If the Bible means at all, it means only as it is intended to mean. Too many have read it as they intend it to mean. It is also a 100% human book, which does not deny it also being divine revelation.

[Maxintosh]

That didn't explain the existance of the first cell.

No but it did explain the question that you asked

 

The first cell on this planet came from bacteria, which arrived here from asteroids traveling through our solar system. The conditions for this bacteria to survive was not available until it was on our planet which, as you probably know, is unique in its order of the planets giving it the right conditions to then multiply. The first cells were very basic but as they adapted to our planets conditions they evolved over time.

 

And there is the possibility that the bible is simply a metaphor, not meant to be taken literally but merely as a guide for how to live your life

Yes this was their culture back then. Remember there were no schools and yet learning ways to be a "better" person was still very important to them. They often times used good metaphors as currency as metaphors were a way for them to learn something. The original bible was destroyed but the elders wanted a way to keep these learned lessons for later generations, so they recreated the bible so their children could always have these "lessons" at hand. The bible is fine until people try to take it literally.

 

Likely this flood could have been the creation of the Mediterranean Sea. For someone living in this area this would have been a universal flood

Yes, they have proven this five or six years ago. You have to keep in mind that these people had the equivalent education of a 8 year old and the area where they lived was "their entire world" to them. A major land mass had moved allowing a flood which they misinterpreted as Gods doing. Some of the people survived and since they saw water everywhere they looked, they just assumed it covered the world. This is how the stories that they told were first started and carried from one generation to another.

[QuietOC]

...and the area where they lived was "their entire world" to them. A major land mass had moved allowing a flood which they misinterpreted as Gods doing.

You might be misinterpreting their educational level. Are you assuming that education has constantly and steadily improved? I don't think there is reason to believe that.

[danerd100]

That is my point if god made man in his own image. How do you explain Evolution?

Or is god a microorganism?

 

Evolution is still a theory. It cannot be proven because it takes place over millions of years, and the theory has been around since 1858

 

Maybe other animals have evolved, but humans came as humans, we did not evolve from a single cell

[socal swimmer]

...

 

The first cell on this planet came from bacteria, which arrived here from asteroids traveling through our solar system. The conditions for this bacteria to survive was not available until it was on our planet which, as you probably know, is unique in its order of the planets giving it the right conditions to then multiply. The first cells were very basic but as they adapted to our planets conditions they evolved over time.

....

 

well this is only one theory, and there are many others. This probably isn't the most scientifically mainstream one either. But that is a topic for another debate.

 

You might be misinterpreting their educational level. Are you assuming that education has constantly and steadily improved? I don't think there is reason to believe that.

 

"</sarcasm>"?

 

Evolution is still a theory. It cannot be proven because it takes place over millions of years, and the theory has been around since 1858

 

Maybe other animals have evolved, but humans came as humans, we did not evolve from a single cell

 

 

 

you do realize that even catholic universities teach evolution?

 

This is what education is for.