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  1. QuietOC

    Why are we obligated to be Patriotic?

    Well, there is actual science to understanding what author's were thinking. By that "logic" we should throw all books away. They are all out of date. Why should we not question whether our poorly evolved brains even can think dependable at all? Logic is a tool, and it needs all the good data it can get, so I'll be keeping my books.
  2. Toyota Echo 29 city/37 highway (revised)? Still sold as the Yaris and gained a few hundred pounds. Need to look further back: Geo Metro XFi (Suzuki), Honda CRX Hf, Honda Civic VX. None of these could be sold today because they lack the safety features required on all new cars. Also the lean burn technique caused some bad emissions.
  3. QuietOC

    Pickens Plan

    I am fine with government spending my money on other people instead of enabling unproductivity here. Most of what our government spends is not on military. What little is spent in Iraqi is probably more likely to benefit Iraqis than that money channeled through government would provide for Americans. But war is at a bare minumum somewhat productive for our economy. Most efforts of government seem mainly adept at devaluing money. Of course, like many Americans, my net monetary worth is negative, so I guess this could be a personal benefit. Big human organizations tend to be monetarily inefficient--too much spent on "management." Big oil, big medical, big whatever--big government is bigger. Even if they were the wisest heads, they can't spend what we give them efficiently--productively. Government can very easily benefit individuals like Pickens, and that sounds like what he is after.
  4. QuietOC

    Pickens Plan

    Perhaps some of those costs are due to the government helping to fix things? Take transportation: Why in the world do cars need to be heavier and heavier to implement government mandated safety features, and yet people can buy any flimsy type of two wheeled vehicle and not even wear a helmet? So gas was above $4 a gallon, and I have seen a lot more older people riding bicycles around my city. People are buying more subcompact cars, and less trucks. Wow, maybe people can freely solve their own problems? Less government involvement is needed, not more.
  5. QuietOC

    Pickens Plan

    Can we please, stop asking government to solve economic "problems"? Mr. Pickens needs to look elsewhere for help if he has such great ideas. Ironic how he shows a Honda car as the solution to foreign oil.
  6. QuietOC


    Is an idiot open-minded?
  7. QuietOC

    Why are we obligated to be Patriotic?

    Or maybe women were treated different socially and Paul's point was not break social customs merely to demonstrate the real equality of women ("There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female"). Anyone who has studied American church history knows that women have been the political and cultural force in American Christianity. The social norm of male pastors/elders/etc. in some corners of Christianity means little in this question.
  8. QuietOC

    Should you be able to bear Arms?

    Bad views about other cultures are often impossible to avoid. Perhaps they require more education? I would like to own weapons such as a hand gun, though I would need to work on using any weapon effectively. I am sure many should not have guns, and we may not be willing to restrict all those who should not have them. I am not scared that Tom, {censored}, and Jane would have a handgun. I would appreciate knowing that several Toms, {censored}, and Janes had handguns if a handgun was needed. It is a scary thought that neither Tom, {censored}, nor Jane should have one when one is needed.
  9. I have generally seen the reverse argument being used, that the fact of human morality implies the existence of God. I am currently listening to G. K. Chesterton's Orthodoxy. Listening to this, it is funny how there has been so little progress made by atheism in the last century. Chesterton was profoundly populist (what he called democratic)--and reminds me more than a little of Mr. Limbaugh. He makes the point that I may have brought up in different terms of historical snobbery--that we write off old ideas merely for being old. He also helpfully points out that modern atheism is not itself a new idea. The diversity of Christianity he views as one of its strengths Incompatible criticisms of Christianity actually led him to it. So, becareful! you don't want to be making any more Chestertons! Actually, It makes sense that human morality did evolve. Why shouldn't it? I think de Waal is just wrong about "literalist Bible readers." The conflict is actually not with the literal words--it is with someone's spirit of what those words mean. He is in a spiritual conflict.
  10. QuietOC

    Why are we obligated to be Patriotic?

    Wasn't one of the points of the United States to avoid this type of nationalism? Personally I feel that more of the world needs the representative government that we enjoy here. Many see these regional blocks like the European Union being the next stage. Our american government model has a pretty good history. It may be falling apart now--a little too national. Patroitism is a good love when it remains at its proper level.
  11. So you don't see human conception as unpredictable? Or are you unhappy with the difficulty in establishing the historicity of the events of Isaiah 7-8?
  12. First, only determinism is rational, thus #2 is not a real option. Chance is the unknowable, capricious god that space-time doesn't require. #1 is actually virtually non-existent for all really significant future events. Even if humans do a lot of work to try to ensure their plans succeed, or predict something highly regular, it is rather easy for the rest of space-time to have something else happen instead. Also just accuracy in general should be required. So while accuracy in general does not demand divinity, any inaccuracy should be reason to reject it. #3 is possible. I would also say in regards to #4, I do not see the information needing to enter space-time from outside. The information is just in space-time. No appeal to supernaturalism--the Creator of space-time doesn't need it! It could appear to be odd, but there will be perfectly sensible, natural reasons why the information appears. While this articulation is mine, this method is biblical. Often a less significant but still unpredictable event is given as a sign for a more signficant event. The "virgin" birth of a son to Isaiah in Isaiah 7-8 is given as a sign about a larger prediction of the fall of a couple of nations. Also this story highlights that it is perfectly okay for a real prophet to play a significant role in bringing about what he has prophecied. I also don't want to limit signs of divinity to just prediction. Though one could reasonably extend the idea to view all real miracles as just unpredictable natural events that both just naturally occur and are in some sense predicted.
  13. I can model something unpredictable on a computer, but to observe the actual outcome of the model all the calculations must be done. Nothing running on the computer can predict the outcome outside of running the actual calculations. Certainly I can run the exact calculations on another computer and "predict" the outcome. However, I am the source for the precise values of the initial conditions and the model in both instances. However any mere space-time observer cannot have precise knowledge of the conditions of space-time--even infinite observers of space-time! So, if we have such predictions they don't come from any observation of space-time, they come from something both beyond and precisely intimate with space-time, and divine is a good word for that.
  14. Repeating your ignorance is not proving anything except your ignorance.
  15. Please take a physics or math course in chaos. Many things just are unpredictable--it is strictly impossible to know their outcome except to wait and observe it. And this condition even occurs in rather simple deterministic systems that are fully understood. It requires knowledge beyond (or behind?) the entire space-time causality itself to predict such things.