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Bootloader EFI Clover

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#701
Mrengles

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Be careful Robert - they have video cameras, it would be better to wait for people who have purchased the machines and volunteer the info which is already available on the net, otherwise you could be made an example of.


I'm not doing anything wrong. I told the Store Manager that I was a "Developer" and needed some hardware information off the New Ivy Brigde Macs to fix bugs. Asked if I could use the Macs on display, she said fine, but I was not to copy/steal the software, which I was NOT doing.

She understood that I could not afford to purchase every single new Mac to bug fix, and was very helpful showing me which models were different.

;-)

Mrengles

#702
tonydickinson

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Ok AYOR.

#703
Mrengles

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Ok AYOR.


Tony,

Sorry, I don't have any kids. I only know LOL, IMHO. :-)

Can you please explain AYOR?

Man I feel old.

Never mind googles my friend.... For all you old farts.

http://www.internets...-definition.asp

#704
comwave7

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I'm not doing anything wrong. I told the Store Manager that I was a "Developer" and needed some hardware information off the New Ivy Brigde Macs to fix bugs. Asked if I could use the Macs on display, she said fine, but I was not to copy/steal the software, which I was NOT doing.

She understood that I could not afford to purchase every single new Mac to bug fix, and was very helpful showing me which models were different.

;-)

Mrengles


Hi, Mrengles, Hi Tony,

Thanks a lot, Mrengles! And I believe the Store Manager is so cool!

In business terms, wouldn't Apple welcome hackintoshers because they are doing some part of Apple Dev team's work, say, testing in various systems and finding optimized ones, even without being solicited?

I think that sort of understanding is shown in that Apple doesn't block hackintoshes from being updated through Software Update Seed Configuration Utility, and in many other things.

I like this policy, esp. compared to Microsoft, which is so sensitive to using its OS for personal test pleasure.

Hopefully, Clover can make big improvements with your sincere help!


P.S. Mrengles, please don't feel old! Life is too short to be divided into young and old, isn't it, IMHO?

#705
tonydickinson

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@comwave7 you said..

"In business terms, wouldn't Apple welcome hackintoshers because they are doing some part of Apple Dev team's work, say, testing in various systems and finding optimized ones, even without being solicited?"



It does not quite work like you describe. If you have seen that awful recent MBC interview Brian Williams and Tim Cook you will understand the feelings Apple have about hackers, and their daily fight against those determined to rip them off, in

theory there is nothing wrong - but in the US they have what they call intellectual property rights.


I do not concur with you say that hackers help Apple, its the other way round

Do not take anything for granted



#706
comwave7

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@comwave7 you said..

"In business terms, wouldn't Apple welcome hackintoshers because they are doing some part of Apple Dev team's work, say, testing in various systems and finding optimized ones, even without being solicited?"



It does not quite work like you describe. If you have seen that awful recent MBC interview Brian Williams and Tim Cook you will understand the feelings Apple have about hackers, and their daily fight against those determined to rip them off, in

theory there is nothing wrong - but in the US they have what they call intellectual property rights.


I do not concur with you say that hackers help Apple, its the other way round

Do not take anything for granted





Hi, Tony!

Thank you for sharing precious viewpoints and advice. I really appreciate them.

Mostly I agree with you.

And I take, and will take, nothing for granted. And sure, I don’t support or advocate IPRs theft.


What follows is not an argument against your points of view, but just a small clue to develop different points of view on my OS X tests. I hope it can be a free exchange of opinions.


I just watched the interview you mentioned. Tim said,

"It's tough. It's very tough. You have people trying to hack into systems on a constant basis. You have people trying to enlist confidential information about future product plans. All of these things are things that we constantly fight."

As far as I understand, Clover developers and users don't go into the category of "people" Tim talked about. The "people" maybe mean those who compete with Apple and especially who try to hurt its business and make their own money from Apple products. And the expression “systems” possibly doesn’t mean OS X, but Apple’s internal systems, I guess, given the context of the conversation.

Thus, I don’t think that remark proves Apple has a negative position against the users who want to have a different experience on their PCs with their own efforts and risks without giving any harm to its business operations. Apple fights agianst hackers and competitors, not against OS X lovers. People at Apple might laugh internally because these self-serviced users may broaden its base for potential customers. I’ve seen many users who first began with installing OS X on their PCs and then move to buying real Macs when they can afford to.

Even though many call their own OS X-loaded PCs "hackintosh", that doesn't mean they are hackers. As for me, I am a sort of follower of Apple. I like its products and philosophy. I still have an 1998 eMac, which lies in the corner of my house for amusing my eyes. Clover bootloader doesn’t hack any code of OS X, AFAIK. It’s just literally a bootloader. And as UEFI technology comes into everyday use, Clover gives us a chance to utilize the new tech to the full. From Clover EFI bootloader, Apple and many other vendors may get hints or learn something. That’s what I tried to imply in my previous comment to mrengles.

And my point of view can become evident in the case of Intel. Take the K versions of Intel CPUs. As you know, years back, there was no CPU whose maximum speed was unlocked. Owing to many enthusiastic overclockers who wanted to experience the best and highest performance, Intel finally changed its product line-up and released K version, e.g. i7 2600K. This change caused ripple effects and let many normal users enjoy higher speed CPUs.

I think Apple can have a similar approach. Why not it adopts such a positive inclusive position as marketing a version of “OS X Mountain Lion for IBM-PC”(my coinage) to let a huge number of PC users enjoy the pleasure of a new world? I believe someday Apple will, though not soon. If this speculation comes true, you and I might be among those “initial pioneers” of OS X for PC versions thanks to many talented and open-minded developers.

#707
Slice

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Some times ago Apple said: "We can't sell OSX to PC users as we can't provide support to non-Apple's hardware". This is reasonable position.
But Microsoft can?

#708
comwave7

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Some times ago Apple said: "We can't sell OSX to PC users as we can't provide support to non-Apple's hardware". This is reasonable position.
But Microsoft can?


Hi, Slice!

Above all, thank you for Clover.

As to Apple's position of NOT selling OS X to PC users, I agree with your evaluation.
It sure would be a headache, much less being profitable.
But considering the simplicity Clover boot loader gives me as a Mac user on a PC, I hope Apple will get a position change.

As to MS, I haven't thought about the possibility of its selling Windows to Mac users as their main OS.
MS seems still busy coping with PC users and catching up with Apple and Google in the mobile market.

Just a layman's guess.

At any rate, Clover EFI boot loader made my system faster, smoother, and more usable.

Thanks a lot, to you and all other developers concerned!

#709
Mrengles

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Here's my new Updated Clover Hack!

ASRock Z77 Professional-M (Patched UEFI by Samisnake)
16Gb Corsair RAM
512Gb OCZ Vertex 4 SSD
Nvidia GTX 670 4Gb Superclocked+
Intel Ivy Bridge i7-3770K
Complete custom water loop, HeatKiller Blocks, EK pump...

Attached File  IMG_7432.jpg   168.63KB   60 downloads

Mac OS X Mountain Lion Screams!

I'm not to much of a photographer but you get the idea. =)

-Mrengles

#710
Mrengles

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If you like to inject custom hardware ID with Clover, this site can be helpful:

http://www.famkruith...et/uuid/uuidgen


#711
tonydickinson

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Hi, Tony!

Thank you for sharing precious viewpoints and advice. I really appreciate them.

Mostly I agree with you.



R u the same Comwave I know from South Korea...? (although with a slightly different handle?

We could discuss this for ever, but likely the biggest plus point for anybody who chooses to ignore the Apple EULA is the fact that Hackers must contribute a great deal to Apple in the form of Apps and other services they provide, and of course Apple know this. Before Steve Jobs returned to Apple they tried years ago to licence OS to third party vendors and it did not work, so as Slice has already pointed out as to why Apple cannot support OSX on PCs and if they were to "sell" it or change the EULA they might be under some obligation to take on the myriad of possible configurations which might obligate them to do more. Not good business. They are happy to leave it to people to do it at their own risk and rely on the likes of the Clover Devs to sort that out which over time they have done magnificently and with dedication. Going back a few years ago after the initial change from Motorola to Intel it was very difficult to achieve a stable osx system. That said Foxcom could perhaps be licensed to sell a motherboard that is Apple compatible and under licence, also if the rumours are correct Apple could be making their own chips post Haswell, they have worked wonders with a customised A6 which does most of what the i7 does more efficiently.

Thing is lets just make it fun and not take it all too seriously, as the only constant in life is change.

You take care and enjoy 12.12.12 12.12pm

#712
Mrengles

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The only reason I hackintosh because I love messing around with OS X, before this Mac OS 7-9.2. I've never owned a PC until now.

I've always owned a Mac, still do. I didn't build a hackintosh for a cheap alternative. As a matter of fact I could have purchased a Mac for much cheaper then my Hackintosh hardware and visa versa.

I think the spirit of Hackintosh, is just like Jobs & Woz blue box "Rebel attitude". Apple could try to stop us... They haven't yet. I don't think we will ever see the day when Apple allows this, unless lawyers get involved, and I don't think they will ever really try to stop it. Unless they move away from Steve Jobs vision for Apple.

Just my two cents.

#713
tonydickinson

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The only reason I hackintosh because I love messing around with OS X, before this Mac OS 7-9.2. I've never owned a PC until now.

I've always owned a Mac, still do. I didn't build a hackintosh for a cheap alternative. As a matter of fact I could have purchased a Mac for much cheaper then my Hackintosh hardware and visa versa.

I think the spirit of Hackintosh, is just like Jobs & Woz blue box "Rebel attitude". Apple could try to stop us... They haven't yet. I don't think we will ever see the day when Apple allows this, unless lawyers get involved, and I don't think they will ever really try to stop it. Unless they move away from Steve Jobs vision for Apple.

Just my two cents.


The only reason I hackintosh is that I had a very bad experience with a 2009 MacPro with all the bells and whistles. Its only useful purpose was as an expensive fan heater as even running iTunes would cause the fans to speed up and the power consumption to peak at around 210 watts. This computer is now on its third logic board and is mainly used to run cron jobs for some websites I host. There was much hassle with Apple and this machine, they never admitted the common problem of itunes causing it to overheat for over 12 months before they found a fix. Over the years I have spent a fortune with Apple going back to the G4 days and their unwillingness to acknowledge the MacPro issues for so long decided me to make my own.., I have never regretted it.

I agree with mrengels OS9 was the most fun, and great for hobbyists although that dates us....he must have really small fingers to get inside his rig, its fun - but should not be taken too seriously.

In fact with the new iMacs getting thinner and updating Ram becoming a major operation I am sure that more people will take the hack option.

#714
antoniodapc

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Can you tell me why booting from USB stick with only the folder efi boot is faster ?
If start from the boot disk takes about two minutes?
Much time remains on the screen load Kernel driver ..........................................

#715
comwave7

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R u the same Comwave I know from South Korea...? (although with a slightly different handle?

Hi, Tony. Yes, I am.
I signed up for several sites at different points of time and used a little varied ids. I don't know why. :wallbash:
Lately, I got an idea and am using a pic of Red Porsche.


We could discuss this for ever, but likely the biggest plus point for anybody who .......
Thing is lets just make it fun and not take it all too seriously, as the only constant in life is change.


120% agreed. Never ending story. Let's have fun to the degree that's permitted.


You take care and enjoy 12.12.12 12.12pm


What an eye-opening coincidence! Five twelves!
Maybe an implication of good luck to you in the coming New Year! :wink2:

#716
tonydickinson

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Can you tell me why booting from USB stick with only the folder efi boot is faster ?
If start from the boot disk takes about two minutes?
Much time remains on the screen load Kernel driver ..........................................


When you attempt to boot Clover from the hard disk are you sure it is not using BIOS as that is considerably slower. Also I have noted when I was testing the HD4000 if the HD4000 config is not quite correct it will slow the boot process as Clover tries to sort out the Graphics. HD4000 seems quite fussy, try an EDID.

Just some ideas... as that does not answer your question regarding USB and HD boot times.

#717
vmacpro

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Test Case: Real MacBookPro 5.1 BIOS Mode

The latest Clover ISO CD version that boots with a Graphical interface "native high resolution" is 883-64bit. Later versions till 929 all give a black screen after showing a high ress white cursor in the top left of the screen. All versions of the Clover ISO have no USB support working! So after Clover starts and you end with the graphical interface no onboard keyboard/touchpad or external mouse / keyboard nor usb disk are working so no response, but the clover LOGO is rotating :-D.

Soon I can try a native fat32 clover install on the internal disk and maybe make some boot logs, because this info is maybe not that usefulll.

This MacBookPro 5.1 uses nvidia chipsets, so maybe thats related to the non functional USB ports just a guess? It has multiple graphic cards but in BIOS mode it only uses 9600GT and not the 9400.

PS: this machine runs Mountain Lion natively.

Update: Clover 954 ISO 64
*It boots Clover ISO to a highress Clover GUI, only if also a USB stick with Clover install is attached and it usb works partly ;-)!
*Keyboard/Mouse internal/usb still dead, burned serveral custom ISO's with/without/combinations drivers (usbmouse/psmouse/Xhci .efi ect) so cannot actualy interact with the Clover GUI Menu
*Hotplug extra USB disks/sticks will show up additional Icons in the Clover GUI, so it doesn't hang :-) but because of lacking keyboard/mouse I cannot interact with it.

Attached Files



#718
comwave7

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Localization
If you want to add your native language to the program please translate the follow files

and upload the result at this thread.


Hi, Slice

I'm comwave7 in Seoul.

Following your instruction, I translated 'TextsToTranslate' into Korean to make many Korean users enjoy your gorgeous bootloader.
Please check the attached translation and let me have your feedback.

In the translating process, I thought the English expressions of your current package installer may need more fine tuning to give a more clear instruction to users. What do you think of this? If you say OK, I'd like to start to touch them.

And one more. If you say OK, I'd like to translate your Russian manual into English and Korean. I can't speak Russian, but I guess I can figure out what you want to say with help of you and Google translator.

I'll look forward to your comments. And thanks for your beautiful work.


Attachments: TextToTranslate-KR.zip

#719
Slice

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Hi, Slice

I'm comwave7 in Seoul.

Following your instruction, I translated 'TextsToTranslate' into Korean to make many Korean users enjoy your gorgeous bootloader.
Please check the attached translation and let me have your feedback.

In the translating process, I thought the English expressions of your current package installer may need more fine tuning to give a more clear instruction to users. What do you think of this? If you say OK, I'd like to start to touch them.

And one more. If you say OK, I'd like to translate your Russian manual into English and Korean. I can't speak Russian, but I guess I can figure out what you want to say with help of you and Google translator.

I'll look forward to your comments. And thanks for your beautiful work.


Attachments: TextToTranslate-KR.zip

Very good!
I will implement this translation immediately.
If you make English manual I can revise it and edit as much as I know English.
Do it!

#720
comwave7

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Very good!
I will implement this translation immediately.
If you make English manual I can revise it and edit as much as I know English.
Do it!


Thank you!

Then, I'll work on the manual first and send it to you when it's done.
I hope there will be many other language versions in the near future.

Cheer up, Clover developers!!!

P.S. Would you please give me a chance to preview the Korean version of Clover installer before general distribution?
I'd like to check whether my translation is good enough to be part of your work.





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