54 replies to this topic

[fantomas1]

Slice

and what about patched 32-bit EFI to run 64-bit kernel on 32-bit CPU (old unsupported Mac)  ?

http://www.insanelym...dpost&p=1842114

[TH3L4UGH1NGM4N]

@fantomas1 From what I gathered, it looks like that's only possible on CPUs that are capable of 64 bit operations.

[fantomas1]

it's like by the past with Lion DP1, on macmini solo core (2006 i think), some people were able to install Lion DP1 on it, DP1 was still in 32-bit !

so like i said, it may be possible with this patched 32-bit EFI coupled with meklort 32-bit patched kernel ML ( i hope   ) to install ML on 32-bit CPU system.

we can dream, right ?  

[Slice]

Do not mix, please. If CPU is 32-bit only then it can run 32-bit only programs. ONLY.
No matter if you make a patch.
Yes, Lion DP1 contains 32bit codes in kernel, in kexts, in programs. It may go with 32bit CPU.
For ML forget! No one chance. No matter if a best hacker in the world will patch the kernel. There are 64-bit only kexts, frameworks and programs.
32bit codes and 64bit codes are different. They can't be adopted by some tricks.

[HUSABER]

Need to replace hardware,inside in Cupertino have big brain..... old hardware out off box...

[yellowviolent]

Slice, on 11 August 2012 - 08:52 AM, said:

Do not mix, please. If CPU is 32-bit only then it can run 32-bit only programs. ONLY.
No matter if you make a patch.
Yes, Lion DP1 contains 32bit codes in kernel, in kexts, in programs. It may go with 32bit CPU.
For ML forget! No one chance. No matter if a best hacker in the world will patch the kernel. There are 64-bit only kexts, frameworks and programs.
32bit codes and 64bit codes are different. They can't be adopted by some tricks.

It's my understanding that a 64-bit CPU (ex. C2D) can run 64-bit frameworks and programs even if the system is booted from a 32-bit kernel. The only restriction would be x64 kexts, because a 32-bit kernel can only run 32-bit kexts. I would just run ML with a 64-bit kernel, but I have GMA 950 for video, so I need either a x64 driver or a x32 kernel so I can run ML like I run Lion right now.

I understand that ML GM has had all 32-bit architecture stripped out, leaving behind only 64-bit. It's also my understanding that this removal was done gradually, more was stripped away with each ML DP. Is there any way we can "Frankenstein" together the 32-bit kexts so the system will load? 64-bit frameworks and programs should run fine on a 32-bit kernel, provided the CPU is capable of 64-bit instruction. This is exactly how Lion is (Finder is 64-bit, etc).

[TH3L4UGH1NGM4N]

Unless ML DP1 had a 32 bit variant of the aforementioned kext for your GMA 950, it will practically be pointless.  To be honest, I find no point in even discussing the usage of a ML 32bt kernel for use in a day to day system.  Let's be honest here for a minute, technology will always be growing and changing and we can't always sit in the past and expect newer stuff to work seamlessly with our legacy products.  Living on the bleeding edge is the Beauty and the Beast of technology.

[meklort]

As has already been mentioned...

Mountain Lion has been released for 64bit only machines. That means that apple decided to remove / not compile things like 32bit kexts and a 32bit kernel. So... you'd not only have to recompile the kernel (very possible), but you'd need to recompile the kernel extensions that have never been released as open source. In other words, no, ML on 32bit only machines won't happen. Sure you can compile the kernel and you could boot it, but things like AppleACPIPlatform won't exist so you'll get an immediate panic.

[yellowviolent]

I don't understand why the GMA 950 kext would need to be from a 10.8 release. It hasn't been updated since Snow Leopard, and the SL kext still works in Lion. A hacked x64 GMA 950 kext with partial acceleration has been released and I found it worked OK in ML GM, not nearly as bad as completely unaccelerated, but not nearly as well as the x32 kext works in Lion. Some of us are still stuck on older hardware. My system in particular can run ML just fine, all hardware components are fully functional with the exception of graphics.

To be so close to perfectly functional day to day system is the point of even discussing the usage of an x32 ML kernel. You know, a lot of people have that same opinion when it comes to osx86 in general. They don't see the point of hacking PC hardware to run OS X when you can just go out and buy a Mac! I agree there comes a time when we need to give old technology the boot, but Macs running with GMA 950 are not that old. It's not like we're discussing hacking 10.8 to run on PPC.

Anyhow, lots of owners of older MacBooks are plenty interested in getting ML to run on their hardware, it's not just a tiny segment of the osx86 community.

meklort, on 12 August 2012 - 02:43 AM, said:

As has already been mentioned...

Mountain Lion has been released for 64bit only machines. That means that apple decided to remove / not compile things like 32bit kexts and a 32bit kernel. So... you'd not only have to recompile the kernel (very possible), but you'd need to recompile the kernel extensions that have never been released as open source. In other words, no, ML on 32bit only machines won't happen. Sure you can compile the kernel and you could boot it, but things like AppleACPIPlatform won't exist so you'll get an immediate panic.

And as I've already mentioned before, 32-bit kexts for ML do exist, in the DP1. I don't see how forcing the system to load an older 32-bit variant of the kext would prevent it from loading.

[meklort]

Sure, the developer previews had 64bit kexts and you'll be stuck with them, you won't be able to update to kernel or extensions as apple releases updates.

As for Running ML on GMA950 macs, that's completely different. The best option is to use the 64bit kernel and the 64bit 950 extensions that were released with 10.6.2. Again, you won't be able to upgrade these, so if apple has changed anything, there may be issues. A 32bit kernel won't help unless if you want to lock yourself into a beta version of ML.

[mnfesq]

meklort, on 12 August 2012 - 03:56 AM, said:

Sure, the developer previews had 64bit kexts and you'll be stuck with them, you won't be able to update to kernel or extensions as apple releases updates.

As for Running ML on GMA950 macs, that's completely different. The best option is to use the 64bit kernel and the 64bit 950 extensions that were released with 10.6.2. Again, you won't be able to upgrade these, so if apple has changed anything, there may be issues. A 32bit kernel won't help unless if you want to lock yourself into a beta version of ML.

So if I understand this correctly, it is more likely that 64-bit video kexts for X3100 and GMA950 can be developed than to try to use a 32-bit kernel to load an older version of those video kexts.  Is that the conclusion we are coming to?

[TH3L4UGH1NGM4N]

@meklort Doesn't make sense to lock yourself into a dev OS that's bound to expire not too long from now.

@mnfesq  The X3100 and GMA950 probably won't be further developed so you'll be stuck with the 64 bit variants that are provided in the 10.6.2.

@yellowviolent You can't set your sights on perfection if you're not living in the reality that 32 bit is just not feasible in ML.  You're better off trying to load the 10.6.2 GMA950 kext as meklort suggested.  You can only hack away at things if you have the proper resources.  Hacking isn't magic by making things out of nothing you need to start somewhere.  I'm not disagreeing with you saying that GMA 950 based Macs are that old but as new software comes in, it becomes more taxing on a system and we all know how Apple is when it comes to axing legacy products from their circle of life.

[Slice]

I have successfully using a hackintosh with GMA950. System installed is OSX 10.7.4. Why I need to install ML DP1 with kexts from 10.6.2? For a what?
See signature.
#2 - IntelX3100
#3 - GMA950

[eep357]

Slice, on 12 August 2012 - 03:58 PM, said:

I have successfully using a hackintosh with GMA950. System installed is OSX 10.7.4. Why I need to install ML DP1 with kexts from 10.6.2? For a what?
See signature.
#2 - IntelX3100
#3 - GMA950

So you can have Growl and Dragon Dictate built in I don't know either, whatever features trying to gain by making ML run on gma950 can be duplicated with 3rd party alternatives and still have well running system. I have hack running ML and Macbook on 10.7.5, don't get me wrong, I like ML better, but mostly because it runs smooth which will be less likely on Macbook for many reason, aside from having to do a hacked install.

[TH3L4UGH1NGM4N]

@Slice As according to what meklort said, he was reffering to the version of the intelgma950 that's both 64 and 32 bit

[eep357]

OK, maybe to put a rest to this..TH3LAUGH1NGM4N and myself just did some testing. Installed the 10.6.2 gma950 kexts, bundles and framebuffer on my MacBook 2,1 with gma950:
 MacBook-1.jpg   170.31K   63 downloads Before doing this, we had 32bit versions loaded under 10.7.5
    MacBook-4.jpg   207.18K   75 downloads  installing the 10.6.2 ones, they loaded in 64bit
 badnewz.jpg   18.45K   68 downloads  they don't work, here's what you get trying to play an avi in VLC
 Desktop & Screen Saver-1.jpg   81.98K   50 downloads flash works, but maxes out the CPU, and no translucent menubar with option completely gone from systemprefs

THEY DON'T WORK!

[Slice]

TH3L4UGH1NGM4N, on 12 August 2012 - 06:36 PM, said:

@Slice As according to what meklort said, he was reffering to the version of the intelgma950 that's both 64 and 32 bit

Yes, I know. Just asked why I need 64bit if it requires so mixed system.
I was tested IntelX3100 with 64bit. I didn't like it. No advantages but many problems.
It is much better to have virgin system running 32bit.
ML-only applications? Sorry, I doubt.

[TH3L4UGH1NGM4N]

appologies, that part was directed to mnfesq that wanted to know about the whole 64 older kexts working.  I would personally find it better as well not to have a mixed hybrid system either as it would induce more issues.

I totally agree with you on having a virgin system because who doesn't like virgins?

Also, so long as you have SL, you'll have the best of both worlds of 32 and 64 bit which is why I still have a SL system around still.

[mnfesq]

Slice, on 12 August 2012 - 07:52 PM, said:

Yes, I know. Just asked why I need 64bit if it requires so mixed system.
I was tested IntelX3100 with 64bit. I didn't like it. No advantages but many problems.
It is much better to have virgin system running 32bit.
ML-only applications? Sorry, I doubt.

For me, running OS X on PC is educational.  I don't "need" to run any version of OS X on my PC - 32-bit or 64-bit.  But I like the idea of learning how the newest Apple operating system works and testing it out on my PC laptop.  I will miss testing ML, or at least its graphics capabilities.   Eventually, I will replace my Inspiron 1720 with X3100 graphics for another laptop - maybe the 1720 with the Nvidia 8600M graphics -- unless I win the lottery, of course.

[Kynyo]

A interesting behavior under Mountain Lion is this:  Screen Shot 2012-08-14 at 9.40.03 PM.png   71.14K   111 downloads      Screen Shot 2012-08-14 at 9.49.14 PM.png   260.64K   97 downloads    Screen Shot 2012-08-14 at 1.54.46 AM.png   34.17K   62 downloads



System from signature!
I think it's a bug, because majority of kexts loaded under 64bit.