The MAC Pro - but not quite

[marian99us]

Halo everyone,

I have a question, that is most probably already answered, but it is hard to search, because the question is about Mac Pro, and not macbook pro, and the search engine of the this Form makes it impossible to search for exact terms (with or without quotations! alas! Google has spoiled us!)

 

So, here goes: i wanted to buy a mac pro and a display of about 40 (<) inches, but then i found out the mac pro was unfairly over priced. I, then, set out to find out which set of hardware would be best suited to Mac OS 10 Leopard (and eventually Snow Leopard and so on!)

I have a budget of about 2200 Euros (as of now 2735.7 USD (according to Google)! ) but if i have to spend this much of money then obviously i am going to buy a Mac Pro and save me all the trouble, but if it is somewhere around 400 euros (500 dollars) cheaper than the original Mac Proi then i am going to go for it!

The following are the things i would be looking for in my Machine!

 

• I want to have 16GB ram (extendable would be great but not required),
  
• 2 TB of Harddisk (no externels please! i want them to be inside the trunk! )
  
• A powerful enough graphics card that can drive upto 40 inches of display! (i am planning ot buy a samsung TV or LG TV, and use it as my monitor, some comments on this would also be more than welcome! )
  
• I want to have 8 cores of processor (i got the idea from the original Mac Pro)
  
• WIFI
  
• Gigabite LAN
  
• bluetooth (but i can use dongle also, so . . .)
  
• i am going to use it as my personal pc so i dont need any RAID support!
  
• I want to install a true copy of Mac OS 10 Leopard on this dream machine because i want to give some credit (money) to apple too! so that means, i dont want to have to install iatkos or Kalyway or leo4all . . . on this machine!
  
• sorry there is a problem with the browser (or the website!) i cant get rid of the bullets anymore.
  
• I just need to find out if it is worth to go out and buy every single piece of hardware to make a might machine or is it better to trust Jobs on this one, and buy a ready-to-rumble Mac Pro ? Please reply in detail! and sorry once again for my inablity to use the search form of this forum!
  
• Love
  
• marian Joans!
  

[sheeplover]

Well, to give a short answer:

 

With a budget of 2200,- Euro you should go for a MacPro or you should downsize your needs.

 

If you want 8 cores you HAVE TO go with a dual xeon config because there are no mainboards using two non-xeon socket 775 cpus.

A xeon quad with 2.66GHz range about 280,-€ each actually here in germany. A workstation mainboard that can take these two is from 400-800€ depending on what you like. Thats about 1.000€ Euro only for mainboard and cpus.

 

2TB or HDD is no big deal. Samsung F1 Raid 1TB (HE103UJ) costs 140,-€ each and they are fast and reliable. Now we have about 1.300€.

 

The typical dual xeon mainboards have a memory fsb of 667MHz, 800MHz max. so RAM is cheap as well ... OCZ Platinum comes for 70,-€ for 4GB .. thats 280,- for 16GB and we have 1.580€ in total.

 

You still need a reliable, powerful and hackintosh compatible gfx card. I got a Zotac GeForce 9800GTX+ AMP! Edition. Quite nice and with 180,- not so expensive. Adding an internal n-class Wifi Card for about 50€ we have a total of 1.800€.

 

We haven't spoken about a PSU so far. For your config I would recommend a good PSU, lets say with cable management and 750W. I got one from beQuiet that I can recommend. ranging about 200,-€ it is a good deal. And a case that can take all these components and looks quite nice ... I just bought the Zalman GS1000 (which is excellent) for 140,-€.

 

Et voilà: 2.140€ in total - and there is still no optical drive, no additional case fan or other than the boxed cpu-fans and no display.

Adding 2 case fans and 2 cpu fans that are silent and quality built we add another 120,-€.

 

 

Now tell me .. is a MacPro overpriced???

 

The "upgrades" in the Apple-Store are overpriced, but no one says you can't buy your own memory or hdds and add them. This comes much cheaper. If you REALLY have the money and think you need such a high grade workstation ... then think again and take a good look at the MacPro. Original, reliable, silent, well built, pure power and so well designed. Go for the ready-to-rumble package. You don't need to trust Apple or DonStevo ... trust in thousands of power-users that rely on their MacPros every day - like me. This thing will make you very very happy!

[marian99us]

Thank you sooo much! (Vielen Dank )

i am so glad to see such a comprehensive reply.

You got me quite convinced but QUITE convinced not completelz, i still have some reservations! (but i am still learning! )

 

How about the Monitor,

just now someone told me that buying a LCD (or plasma) TV as Monitor is not a good idea!

but she failed to explain why, i was thinking of buy a Samsung from Saturn (a very enticing angebot only for 700 euros 37 inches with same resolutions as Cinema Display from Apple! )

 

 

Thanks for the reply!

[THEHAWKs]

For 2200 Euro you could get a System That is Close to What i have "Look At SIG" and It Wont Cost you 5,000 $US "Mac Pro"

 

 

Instead of the 4 x 1 TB Drive you would get 2 x 500 GB

 

change my PSU for a SILVERSTONE DA1200 1200W

 

and for CPU get Two Intel Xeon E5420 2.5 GHz you can overclock them to 3.5 GHz EASY

 

Gat a 9800 GX 2 or Lower

 

and there you go you just saved your Self over 2,000 $US

[gorg]

You get what you pay for. As much as I like the Apple's case aesthetics and software/hardware robustness, the MacPro is horribly overpriced, limited and underpowered. On top of this, you are stuck with Apple's attrocious warranty and service (not everyone lives in USA, UK or Germany).

 

I would prefer to build the computer myself. I want multiyear warranties for each hardware component seperately, it's not practical to send your Mac away everytime something malfunctions. I'd like to have a better PSU. I 'd like to have the option of selecting my GFX card and expanding the CPUs. I'd like to overclock if I ever wish to. I 'd like to have a watercooled dead-silent machine without voiding the warranty.

 

If you are on a budget you may find the MacPro a viable solution (due to Apple getting premium price discounts from Intel on Xeons). If you dream of having the ultimate hardware platform for running MacOSX then Apple is not going to help you.

[sheeplover]

Regarding the monitor:

 

Buying a plasma to work with is a horrible idea. They are meant to watch movies on it therefore they don't offer the same resolutions than a typical monitor. If you just like to surf and, well ... watch movies on it - then you can go for a Plasma.

[Reveeen]

If you just like to surf and, well ... watch movies on it - then you can go for a Plasma.

 

And a G5.

 

 

Seriously: you are buying a large chunk of computing power there I *wonder* if you really need it?

[sheeplover]

@reveen: I can't believe that he has any need for such high performance components - as he says he needs no RAID support because "it is his personal pc". What I do believe is that a 24" iMac or a used G5 fullfills all of marian99us's needs - but it always a question of you personal favor and financial situation ;-)

 

 

@thehawk: may I ask you what you use your system for? The Intel Skulltrail mobos are layed out for server and workstation purposes. The don't perform so well in a typical desktop or gaming situation. (For everyone who disagrees, take a look at the benchs at thg or similar) I would never recommend such a system to someone who doesn't use it in a production environment. At least because it is highly expensive. As I pointed out you pay about 1.000€ for the mobo and the 2 Xeons and you need a bigger case, a more powerful PSU etc.. In such a case you pay money for stability and reliability - a price a "normal" user does not necessariliy need to pay.

[Reveeen]

Sheeplover:

 

I am forever scratching my head as to people's wants/needs. (wasn't it a "financial situation" that started this exercise in mental masturbation?)

 

I feed 720p HDTV to a plasma from a tricked out G4, and, BTW all my "home computers" use/have RAID, in one form, or another.

[THEHAWKs]

@reveen: I can't believe that he has any need for such high performance components - as he says he needs no RAID support because "it is his personal pc". What I do believe is that a 24" iMac or a used G5 fullfills all of marian99us's needs - but it always a question of you personal favor and financial situation ;-)

@thehawk: may I ask you what you use your system for? The Intel Skulltrail mobos are layed out for server and workstation purposes. The don't perform so well in a typical desktop or gaming situation. (For everyone who disagrees, take a look at the benchs at thg or similar) I would never recommend such a system to someone who doesn't use it in a production environment. At least because it is highly expensive. As I pointed out you pay about 1.000€ for the mobo and the 2 Xeons and you need a bigger case, a more powerful PSU etc.. In such a case you pay money for stability and reliability - a price a "normal" user does not necessariliy need to pay.

 

my System is mostly used as a Dump Server but i do use it for Adobe and other Photo/Audio/Video, and i did not want to Pay the High price of a Mac Pro. if i wanted to get a Mac pro for about the same hardware it would cost me 8,000 $US vs 5,000 $US. for that price Apple should Give away a Free Screen but the only thing they would give up is free Shipping LoL.

[Morphius Faydal]

@thehawk: may I ask you what you use your system for? The Intel Skulltrail mobos are layed out for server and workstation purposes. The don't perform so well in a typical desktop or gaming situation. (For everyone who disagrees, take a look at the benchs at thg or similar) I would never recommend such a system to someone who doesn't use it in a production environment. At least because it is highly expensive. As I pointed out you pay about 1.000€ for the mobo and the 2 Xeons and you need a bigger case, a more powerful PSU etc.. In such a case you pay money for stability and reliability - a price a "normal" user does not necessariliy need to pay.

 

"Skulltrail" actually *is* a gaming setup. It *does* use the server chipset, and the memory clock won't go as high as an X48 or equivalent board, but a "Skulltrail" system is marketed and designed for gamers. Back when they were first annouced, they stomped other machines into the ground. Now that they've been out for a bit, and there's been new chip/chipset/gpu releases, they aren't as hot. Still got a lot of bragging rights to them though.

[marian99us]

@reveen: I can't believe that he has any need for such high performance components - as he says he needs no RAID support because "it is his personal pc". What I do believe is that a 24" iMac or a used G5 fullfills all of marian99us's needs - but it always a question of you personal favor and financial situation ;-)

@thehawk: may I ask you what you use your system for? The Intel Skulltrail mobos are layed out for server and workstation purposes. The don't perform so well in a typical desktop or gaming situation. (For everyone who disagrees, take a look at the benchs at thg or similar) I would never recommend such a system to someone who doesn't use it in a production environment. At least because it is highly expensive. As I pointed out you pay about 1.000€ for the mobo and the 2 Xeons and you need a bigger case, a more powerful PSU etc.. In such a case you pay money for stability and reliability - a price a "normal" user does not necessariliy need to pay.

 

 

well, i must acknowledge, you did ruffle my feathers!

i, actually, do not have a lot of computing to do with my pc.

I am just a bit over ambitious i guess,

 

it is like buying a Porsche (for non european friends: Ferrari), you don't really need the car, or the power, you are probably never going to be able to unleash the complete power of the engine (unless you happen to find yourself in Germany on a no-speed-limit Autobahn! with out the traffic i.e. )

So, I hope I made my case but i still admit, i don't really need the power, but I want it

 

If I am little dishonest, i could make a point by saying i am an Automation Engineering student, and i need to buy this computer because i often need to do stuff that requires a lot of computing (bulshiit! my laptop tablet is more than sufficient for all my computing needs )

[andsteele]

Personally, I would just buy the Mac Pro and then over time upgrade the ram to 16GB and the other upgrades you need. Running OS X on a PC is really more trouble then it's worth. The computer you are describing sounds quite powerful, so I would imagine you are using it for something important. You'll have a much more rewarding experience owning a Mac.