Back to the Roots - support older versions of OS X!

[naquaada]

Hello!

 

As  I started here in 2006, everyone had their different PC's with lots of different processors and chipsets. This has changed, because the most are using Intel chipsets today. There were also questions if OS X is working on an Pentium 4 - this has not changed, I installed Leopard on a 14 year old Laptop with a 3 GHz P4 HT without SSE3.

 

As somebody who still used Leopard in 2016 as main system I could tell you about a lot of the lack of software. Firefox development sopped at version 16, Flash at version 9. I always got an error in YouTube 'You have to update your browser'. However, it still worked. But my Opteron 185 was too slow for H.264, so YouTube and different other videos were a pain, HD movies were impossible. That's why I switched to an Core i7, not because of the lack of software. I still have Leopard working on different systems because some programs are just better.

 

Dropping support is a very big problem. Apple does this f.e. with iOS updates, so the iPhone 4 can't be upgraded anymore. Different Intel-Macs can't support the newest OS X versions. Even compiled 'AppleScript' versions are incompatible between the versions. And since a longer time it is even not possible to install Windows 7 in BootCamp. But also other companies are doing this, especcially manufacturers of Smartphones and Tablets. Luckily Android is free and with Cyanogenmod you can get on the most of your devices an actual version.

 

I see a beginning lack of support of older versions also in the OSx86 scene. Not only because of the drivers, because of the software. Why are there two versions of the Clover Configurator? Is it neccessary to have two versions? Will it happen that the 'Classic' version, will not be continued sometime? I actually have this problem in Snow Leopard. There is enough actual software for this system, so it is not old-aged. It is also the fastest OS X depending on the graphics, it also carries no iOS stuff. It doesn't even need the SSSE3 command set, so there's no need for a lots of older processors. But the OSx86 utilities won't work on it. Clover Configurator is blocked, so it would only be possible to install Clover with lots of manual plist text editing. Or you have to use Chameleon/Chimera, and I lost on two different machines Bluetooth capability. I also wanted to run on my Thinkpad X61t Andy's Apple Display Emulator. But neither this tool nor the Darwin Dumper won't work on Snow Leopard. Not to mention the driver itself, on a desktop computer. Actually I have the versions 10.5.8, 10.6.8, 10.9.5 and 10.12.0 on perhaps 7 different boards, could you imagine how diffcult it is two find the correct kexts? It was really astounding that chris1111 posted a thread how about creating an Snow Leopard install USB stick. However, it didn't work because the AppleScript version he used was too new for Mavericks. Clover also has problems with older versions: On my Zotac board Snow Leopard won't boot, a cloned version of this installation boots on a Gigabyte board. Leopard isn't booting at all. I'm storing all kexts in /System/Library/Extensions so they don't mess up.

 

I think ther would more people than me who would appreciate support for older versions. There may be somebody who has purchased for a lot of money QuarkXpress 9 a longer time ago. He can't afford the new one and also don't need it, version 9 is good enough. But he has to stick with 10.8, because QXP 9 doesn't even work with Mavericks. But well, noticing that Snow Leopard is much faster than Mountain Lion, he builds a machine for QuarkXpress only. However, a lot of OSx86 software won't work. So, is it neccessary that new OSx86 tools - they are usually rather small and for just one purpose - always need the newest OS X version? The first OSx86 kernel already incooporated the SSE3 emulator to support more CPUs. And the actual kernels for AMD and more have taken this idea further. How far would the owners of those systems be now if the compatibility development of the kernels has dropped at the same rate of the software?

 

My message to all OSx86 developers: Make your software at least compatible to Snow Leopard. It is a great OS X, fast and without unneccessary stuff. Personally I'd also like support for Leopard, because it is still well-suited for older 32bit machines.

 

Thanks, naquaada.

[blackosx]

I know the DarwinDumper v3 UI will not run on Snow Leopard but does DarwinDumper v2.9.9.2 not run on 10.6?

 

BTW: I have QuarkXpress 8 running on 10.12.1 just fine.

[naquaada]

I don't know, needed this tool just for creating an EDID actually.

 

This is also one thing, it isn't clear which version of won't work on which version. On the site of Onyx this is very well made.

[J Lamp]

I had to put together a 32bit Lion machine to run some older audio hardware on Logic Pro. I had some issues (and still do) with Clover reporting the system hardware incorrectly. This issue didn't occur with newer versions of OS X, so I'm pretty sure it's simply a compatibility issue with the older OS.

 

I understand that the devs have their hands full keeping up with annual software updates and whatever brilliance they're cooking up, but my 32 bit Lion audio box is a fantastically powerful and valuable tool. I could go back though my own archives and dig up an older version of Chameleon, but I like to believe the machine will run better with all the advancements that have been made in the boot loaders in the time since Lion.

 

I think there are some great arguments for backwards compatibility. As all of us here, I assume, are motivated by more altruistic intensions as opposed to Apple's possible profit intensions to limit backwards compatibility, I think it's incumbent on us to try and support as much hardware as we can, instead of following Apple's lead and playing by Apple's rules (not playing by Apple's rules being exactly what this place is about  )

[Slice]

I am sorry but latest Clover is working on my Lion 32bit.