lucdavey Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Hi peoples, I'm not sure if anyone else has experienced this, but I don't seem to be able to match my benchmarks when using nullcpumanagement. I'm able to use apple intel CPU management but my heaven benchmarks drop 20 points. In using an overclock i5 3750k which is running at 4.4ghz. Overclocked ram and overclock gpu(via video card bios). I've tried using ssdt for the CPU although I don't really need it to run apple power management, but still can't beat or match the benchmarks that nullcpumanagement gets. Has anyone else noticed this? I use my PC for a lot of gaming etc so I prefer performance over power saving features generally. Is there any problems using nullcpumanagement? My idle CPU seems to use 4 extra watts but under load it seems to be running at the same power usage has when using apples CPU management. Temperatures are normal, under load it's the same, idle seems to be the same as well. What do you guys think? I've seen people say it's going to cost a lot more to run my PC with power bills, but I don't leave it on all the time, only when I'm using it so the little extra power under idle shouldn't be an issue. Curious to see if anyone else has noticed the performance boosts from nullcpumanagement? Please feel free to share any info about this you many have. Many thanks for reading my post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gringo Vermelho Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I can't find any references to that CPU anywhere...did you mean 3570K? If so, I have the same CPU, with a similar overclock. The only logical answer is that your CPU power management was configured incorrectly, or at least not optimally. How to configure it 100% "correctly" remains a mystery, perhaps unless you're part of the Alpha family. It makes total sense that it would run faster when blocking CPU power management. If you prefer performance over power saving then by all means use NullCPUPM and be happy. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Thanks for your reply. Yeah 3570k sorry my bad, I always get the 5 and 7 mixed up lol When you say block CPU power management, it's blocking osx power management and just using the bios/CPU as the power management? My CPU still idles at 1.6ghz etc so I was assuming that was the bios or hardware controlling it instead of osx controlling it ? Also, I can see that the CPU is using around 4more watts at idle than with using apple CPU management, under load it's a bit hard to tell exactly, but I assume the load power usage would be the same with or without nullcpu and that the only extra power usage would be at idle? A 4 watt increase on idle doesn't bother me much as when my computer is on I'm generally using it anyways. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gringo Vermelho Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I don't know how power management works....I can only assume that it's somehow working "on its own" if you can still see the CPU switching states in hardware monitor. About power usage under load, it makes sense that it should be higher if performance is higher. If it isn't, well then you're now drawing 4 more watts when idle, that you aren't drawing when running at full throttle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Are you using apple intel CPU management or null CPU? If your using apple CPU management and are bored one day, try using nullcpu and bench mark both with heaven. I would be curious to see if you get a slight drop in scores. I was getting the feeling that apples CPU management was a little slow on response time to increase CPU speed, and that may have been the reason it was scoring lower without nullcpu. Although as you said I may not have had it set up right. Although it seemed to be, was idling correctly and only using 1.8watts at idle etc. with null it's using 5.5 watts at idle, and responds instantly when I open an app etc. when I say responds instantly, I mean I see it go from 1.6 to 4.4 instantly, where as when I was using apple CPU management, it delays about 1/2 a second before bumping up CPU speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimentel Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Hello You can try read in here for more info about PM: http://www.insanelymac.com/forum/topic/295587-power-management-for-sandyivy-bridgehaswell-cpus/ Sometimes you need choose a different SMbios... Correct SMbios for me is iMac12,1, but with it i get only 2 states x16 and x34I just change my SMbios for MacBook Pro 8,1 and i get 8 states(16,20,25,28,30,32,34,35) isn't great i'd like get 10 states or more, but... is good. You can try a diferente model identify(SMbios) 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gringo Vermelho Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I see you still haven't fixed the bridgers. luc: I haven't tried blocking it, last time I did that was on my Pentium 4 Hackintosh back in 2009. I'll post here if I do. I'm using AppleIntelCPUPM with ssdt generated by Pike's script, I've also tried Mavericks' new kernel cpu power management (-xcpm kernel flag) but it didn't "feel" any different and I couldn't figure out how to get rid of some error messages in kernel.log. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Ok cool . Yeah that's what I was using pikes script. It works good an pretty easy to use. It just feels dirty using nullcpu lol but i doubt I'm going to notice a difference with power bills. Hopefully not anyways lol Oh I just realised you were are the same person I was talking to in an earlier post when I was trying to get the ssdt working Did you do any editing of the script at all or just ran it and told it what CPU you had and that's it? If possible I wouldn't mind testing your ssdt to see if there is any difference. Although I should just let it go and use nullcpu I am still curious as to why I can't match it's performance with native apple CPU management. Keeps me busy anyways, I end up drinking less alcohol lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gringo Vermelho Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 My ssdt is generated specifying the clock, bus frequency and max turbo state of my overclock. None of those will match yours. You don't have to tell it which CPU you have, the i5-3570k is automatically recognized by the script. The only time you'd need to override/specify the CPU model is when you're running the script for a different CPU than the one that is installed. All you should have to do is add what you need to override in order to match your overclock. Try the latest version but run it with -h first to see how it works now, many things have changed since the last time we talked. I live in the middle of a field at the corner of a dirt road, and I have to go for a ride to buy anything - potential substance abuse problem solved lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Oh new version. Ok will defiantly try that. So I won't run the command we were using in the other post. Just to clarify I shouldn't have to edit the script itself before running it? I'll just use -h to find hway commands to use. Run script, use dsdt to compile then good to go? Last time I did it I was editing the script to try and get less p states incase that was what was causing the slight performance drop. Btw, you provide so much support here you should be paid for it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimentel Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Hello I see you still haven't fixed the bridgers. I'll update this guide and fix it 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Lol I'm a 2 minute walk from a bottle shop. It's unfortunately convenient. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gringo Vermelho Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 No need to touch the script itself I think, unless Pike says so. All you need to set can be set from the command line. Also it should auto-compile the ssdt, or maybe it does that here because I have the IASL binary in /usr/bin (anyway, it will if you copy IASL to usr/bin). So yes, run it with -h first to show the available settings. I'm on Windows now so I can't point out the correct switches to you. I do remember something that threw me off at first, there is a -t switch for something else that I can't remember right now and so max turbo state is set with -turbo. I don't want to get paid getting paid to do "whatever it is I do here" would take the fun out of it, because then I would be expected to do certain things that I don't feel like doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Lol I understand. Ok gave it a go. Can't get a bench mark in though cause osx is auto rebooting after being up for about 2 minutes. Every time lol. Even my old ssdt is doing that too. Confused as to what I've changed since before :/ I used to have all the fixes ticked in clover. But unticked them all a while ago. I'll try that then work backwards I guess. Weird that it's happening at the same time every boot that it's crashing. For those few minutes before it works perfectly too lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gringo Vermelho Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Woah. Console.app -> system.log. Every event is timestamped. Looking for events timed around your insta-reboot might help track down why it's doing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Ok going through it now. But I think I fixed it but I don't understand how. I'll give it a few minutes and see. Changed a setting in bios power management. I'll update in a sex. Sec*. Sorry iphone. Thinks it know best lol Ok to fix the auto reboot I enables high precision event timer and changed soft-off by pwr-button to delay 4 secs. That fixes that problem. I flashed my bios a while ago, never thought about those 2 settings. Heaven bench mark is 9 points lower than null CPU. But that's, well, it's acceptable but it's still 9 points lol. Geekbench is the same, it never really changed. Whenever is use a ssdt I still get [AGPM conteolller] unknown platform. Which I don't usually get. And that network delay is not specified spam that I've heard is not a big deal. Agpm controller confuses me though. The ssdt has nothing to do with gpu. I didn't think. Unless i was using onboard video, which I'm not. Gpu still is performing as normal, although it drops 9 points in heaven and has that error. And the CPU is performing the same scores in geek bench. Which makes me think I lost the 9 points from something gpu related. But how can apples CPU management be affecting my gpu... This my friend Weill be sending me on that 2 minute walk I was talking about earlier lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gringo Vermelho Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 HPET should be enabled, it's required for CPU power management to work correctly on OS X. If you have flashed your BIOS and changed CPU power management settings, you should definitely re-extract and repatch your DSDT. AFAIK the unknown platform error happens because graphics power management also matches on model identifier, and so if you're using iMacx,y it expects a video card similar to the one found in an iMacx,y. You can patch AGPM to make this error disappear (google AGPM unknown platform for more info), or you can change model identifier. As Pimentel demonstrated earlier, model identifier also has an impact on CPU power management. Z77 chipset + i5 3570K works well with iMac13,1 or 13,2 for CPU power management - I don't know what video card you have though...I know at least one model of the iMac13,1 uses a GTX 6xx family Kepler GPU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Yeah everything is set up for this bios, I did a complete re-install I'm using iMac 13,2, my video card is Radeon hd 7950. I've always used 13,2 but could try 13,1 too. How many p and c states do you have in your ssdt ? Mines got over 20. But I don't see it use many of them lol actually most of the time it hangs around 3.8 -4 ghz, even at idle. The watts the cpu is drawing is only 1.7 so power management is working, it just isn't dialling the clock down much. It goes to 1.6ghz but doesn't go there much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 26, 2014 Author Share Posted February 26, 2014 Also do you drop ssdt's like cpupm and cpue1st? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gringo Vermelho Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 As far as I know Chameleon doesn't allow dropping specific tables? If you don't set DropSSDT=y then ssdt tables placed in /extra will not be loaded. I haven't tried leaving any other SSDTs alongside the one generated by the script. IIRC I have four, one has some SATA controller code in it, I can't remember right now. 1600 MHz is the lowest frequency for the i5-3570K. Apparently mobile versions will go as low as 800MHz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimentel Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 Hello If you don't set DropSSDT=y then ssdt tables placed in /extra will not be loaded. I don't think so.. i can't enable DropSSDT, if i enable it, i get a error strange and i think this is a undeterminable because i never saw in nowhere how fix this... I just left unchecked (DropSSDT=No) And my SSDT is loaded, even i have disabled DropSSDT Because this, i think iMac 12,1/12,2 doesn't work for me(i get only 2 states)but MacBook Pro work(8 states)... I'm just saying is that if he check DropSSDT and get the same error that I got, I should not worry because the SSDT loads but doesn't work right... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 26, 2014 Author Share Posted February 26, 2014 Yeah, I'm using clover, I can drop specific tables. If I drop all of them I can't boot, but if I drop just cpupm and E1st then.... theres no change really. Performance is the same and no errors either way. What I haven't tried is using Mac Pro instead of iMac... I'll test and see if theres any difference. I googled about the AGPM unknown platform error on boot, and the only things I can find is people that are actually not able to boot or have some serious system performance loss and some fairly complex fixes For me, I get the error message but I can't notice any other changes. I get the 10point drop in my heaven benchmarks, but also go that if use applecpu management but just generate p states on boot instead of using custom sstd for cpu(i don't get the error message when doing this). Sleep on the other hand works amazing. Its a bit slow to sleep, maybe 40seconds. But wake up is instant So I would probably keep the sstd and suffer the 10point loss in performance, but the error message I'm still keen to either fix, or dismiss as something insignificant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimentel Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 Hello Clover generate P and C States automatically for your CPU, but sometimes it doesn't generate correct TDP number, so... my advice is that you continue using PM gave by SSDT... I get this AGPM unknown plataform, but i don't notice problem... Only if you get a lowest performance, you need adjust this... Now....Your hack is work perfect? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucdavey Posted February 27, 2014 Author Share Posted February 27, 2014 Yeah I turn off generate p and c states. At the moment I'm using the custom ssdt for the CPU but using nullcpu management. I have perfect sleep, speed step is working as well and performance is the highest I have seen it. Basically I used the script with turbo 4405 and the ivy bridge fix. Without null cpu management performance is not as good, I think apples CPU power management is {censored}, especially for gaming etc. lol. Using nullcpu my CPU controls itself, but now I left the CPU ssdt things like sleep that usually don't work good with nullcpu are working perfectly. I'll make a little guide or post about it when I have a chance. I'm really happy with it now, I think nullcpumanagement is the way to go if you want the best possible performance. You can test yourself if you are curious, benchmark with heaven, then drop nullcpumanagement in, rebuild and reboot and benchmark again, you may see like me around a 13 point increase in scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimentel Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 Hello So... continue using this method... If this worked to you... Seize 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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