My friend's father asked me to do a website for him. He does refurbishing of furniture and contractor work etc. The site will have like a nice frontpage and gallery of his work. The site will also include secure checkout software. All of these will be integrated, and I'm giving him advice on ADs and etc. since he is computer inexperienced. What do you guys think?

improve search by keywords, not just the meta keywords part, but also ad keywords in titles.
it may be long but that's how google do search nowadays. register to google maps too improves search.

No, I mean price. How much money do I ask him for?

Do you know how to implement everything already or will you be learning as you go?
Will you be doing ongoing support?
How long do you expect to take to implement the desired features he requires?

Are you looking for a "normal" commercial rate or just a reasonable sum to charge a friend?

In order:

1. I already know how to do this.
2. Yes
3. Around half a month
4. Somewhere in between, he's not such a close friend so I would lean more toward commercial pricing. Give me an estimate for both.

$500-$800

$500-$800? That's completely nuts...no one would even consider it at that price. I would actually do it for free, its so easy even a kindergartner could do it. Throw in Joomla, EasyGallery, and VirtuMart together and voila you have instant site. I say don't charge anything since its so easy. I mean like if you had to design a custom template and do lots of manual coding I could understand a charge but just a Joomla installation and installing a couple components takes <15min.

I know pcwiz, but he wants to pay me so..

I didn't just pull those numbers out of my ass. I actually know a few web designers and asked. Computer work isn't cheap. I personally charge $175/hr and $1.10/per mile for repair/troubleshooting/consulting, and I'm cheap.

Hmm, I'd take around 200-300 USD from him. Sounds alright?

Not for commercial sites. I worked 2 years designing web sites for a graphics designer and prices started at $300 even for a few static pages.


Doesn't matter, you are providing a service and as such if you are maintaining a professional relationship, compensation is appropriate.

The one thing most self-employed people do is under value their time. Whether its thinking about the design before you touch anything, or when repairing computers, it grinding away re-installing Windows , it all is billable.

Plus, soon as you do it free, you've almost set the environment/relationship for future additions.

MoC if it is simple and I wanted to "help" out a semi-friend's business, I would probably just charge a flat rate of $200. (Not sure how any hours you meant by half a month)
The company I worked for still charges $300 base and $75 hour for reference. (Most of these customers are high end professionals, financial businesses, lawyers, etc.)

I guess $200 sounds OK, $100 would be even better. Its just hard for me to imagine for something so simple. Maybe I should open up my own installation service.

It does, and I feel weird charging prices myself but it's money that I will most likely need. Websites for people who just know to turn on the computer are amazing, let alone them being able to manage it easily. I'm going to open up web services on my site

I would say $200 maybe $250 at the most.
That your getting paid for your work and He doesn't feel as if he has taken advantage.
There is a fine balance in these things. But in the end you have to go with what feels right to you
and not what everybody is saying or charging.

Thanks for your humble opinion. I think I'll do just that.

You say $200, but not what people are saying, I said $200.

MoC said half a month, I don't know how many hours that means, but assuming 20, charging $200 that's only $10 an hour.
May be a simple site, but I know my time is worth more than $10/hr. You are right that each person has to ask himself that same question.

1. Make his website.
2. Don't give it to him.
3. Hold it as a hostage.
4. ???
5. Profit!

I'll take one #4 please

Right from someone who does this all the time

Frontpage + Gallery: $100
Checkout Integration: $125
SEO + Ads: $75

Total: $300

The reason the prices are high is because the site is commercial and he/she will make money out of it. If its non profit then that is a cheaper story. Also I think he would want you to setup the site on the server etc.

Thank you very much Suhail!

Seriously. $300 is still cheap.

Like whoever said: People undervalue their time.

Ok, so I'm going to do my best not to jump up on a soapbox, but the whole frelance pricing thing really hits home a bit.

You want to give him a fair deal, give him one, just keep in mind, that "fair" is determined by the "market value" of what you're doing. Do it for way over, and you're taking advantage. Do it for way less, and you're taking advantage (this time, of the marketplace and other designers)

Both of those scenarios have much broader effects that you may think. When you overbid, you effect the marketplace and you either force the price up, or you don't get any work. When you underbid, you get lots of work at the expense of the marketplace,and prices are forced down, thus hurting the marketplace.

I'm not going to tell you what to charge, but I will say that when you ask for advice about commercial work, you need to be ready for the answers, and also ready to accept the answers. If another professional says "I charge "X" for job "Y" you should either take that as the median, or do more research. If you ask and then you say "thats too much, they must be wrong" you do nothing more than show how inexperienced you are.

Please don't take this as a flame, I really do not mean it that way. I really hope that all freelancers, if they learn nothing else from anyone, learn how to not "kill the goose" by underbidding themselves. There's alot of work out there, compete on skill and style, not on price.

Thanks guys, and again, please no flame intended.

K2 (a freelancer)

Hi guys, this is a bit off topic but I guess Master of Computer has his answer

Thanks to you, I've just discovered Joomla, EasyGallery, and VirtuMart.
Those are great tools for me cuz I'm a noob but I'll need to create my own merchant web site in a few weeks. And can't afford to pay for a web designer.

My question is: are there tools like those ones (Joomla, EasyGallery, and VirtuMart) running on OSX ?
I mean, I can't afford to buy any software, and I'd like to stay on mac, plus the fact that I'm a total noob that needs WYSIWYG: is there a solution for me ?

Thanks all

I'll just have to see where it goes eventually K2. Thanks for the tidbit

@hackintom: Yes there is. Just get a hosting service and install those scirpts on the server. Then, if you can login to insanelymac you can finish the site.

hackintom,

Joomla, and EasyGallery + VirtuMart (which are Joomla COMPONENTS) are completely web based so it doesn't matter what OS you have. As long as you have a web browser and an FTP client you are OK.

~pcwiz, MoC, thanks, I didn't notice it was web based components !
It's good news, I guess I just have to get to work on my shop

No problem, anytime

Hmmm does this mean I am bad in never charging for a website I have made?