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Forceman
Forceman
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Right because it's a leverage which Novell is willing to take, rather than tell them to open their protocols, If novell was that strong on opensource,(which they are not because they are a mixed source company) then they wouldn't have signed a agreement with Microsoft to not get sued over so called patents which Linux is supposed to be infringing on.

 

Then they come up with the story that it's to protect their customers, NOT the opensource and Linux community as a whole. BTW, I didn't say I am or was going to boycott Novell products, you put words into my mouth. Novell were dropping of the face of the earth and a last ditch attempt was to buy SUSE Linux to save themselves. They were never Novell products, They even brough Appamour off another company, it's not their work, gnome and all them projects were there long before Novell came along. ;)

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snakeeyes
snakeeyes
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they should, they don't really like linux like we do. for them its only compiz and I can bet majority of the people found out about ubuntu about the vista vs beryl video on youtube.

 

after compiz was released thats when majority of the linux users actually started coming in.

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Forceman
Forceman
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Don't forget XGL/Compiz, I bet a huge majority of new users would go back to Windows without compiz. I have seen loads of people in the ubuntuforums who have said that if they can't get compiz to work then they have no reason to use Linux.

 

Only SUSE use XGL which is pretty much obsoleted by AIGLX, XGL has code before, they just decided to dig it up. Loads of users where using Linux before compiz came along, it just adds the cool factor. People dont use Linux for compiz and cool effects you know.

 

BTW before all these cool effects came along Linux was said to be ahead of OS X user base so I dont know where he gets that idea that Linux has the majority of users because compiz. :thumbsup_anim:

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snakeeyes
snakeeyes
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Only SUSE use XGL which is pretty much obsoleted by AIGLX, XGL has code before, they just decided to dig it up. Loads of users where using Linux before compiz came along, it just adds the cool factor. People dont use Linux for compiz and cool effects you know.
R u sure about that cause it seems the first time any new user joins a forum, the first thing is ask is how to setup compiz.
BTW before all these cool effects came along Linux was said to be ahead of OS X user base so I dont know where he gets that idea that Linux has the majority of users because compiz. :thumbsup_anim:
Linux still doesn't have as many users as OS X, where do u get your information from? OS X has better apps, easy of use, better looks, I doubt Linux will ever over take OS X.
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InorganicMatter
InorganicMatter
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Right because it's a leverage which Novell is willing to take, rather than tell them to open their protocols, If novell was that strong on opensource,(which they are not because they are a mixed source company) then they wouldn't have signed a agreement with Microsoft to not get sued over so called patents which Linux is supposed to be infringing on.

 

"The patent coverage does not give Novell any immunity from being sued for patent violations."

http://en.opensuse.org/FAQ:Novell-MS#But_t..._can_sue_others

It's all about the interoperability. It has nothing to do with patents or source code.

 

Then they come up with the story that it's to protect their customers, NOT the opensource and Linux community as a whole. BTW, I didn't say I am or was going to boycott Novell products, you put words into my mouth. Novell were dropping of the face of the earth and a last ditch attempt was to buy SUSE Linux to save themselves. They were never Novell products, They even brough Appamour off another company, it's not their work, gnome and all them projects were there long before Novell came along. :unsure:

 

Your camp is the last one that needs to be complaining about using other products. Compiz+XGL, Ubuntu's pride and joy, and main source of userbase, was invented by...guess who?

 

And how many of them projects did Novell make?, go on, make me laugh.

 

"Novell has also created or is among the top sponsors of projects such as the Linux Kernel, GCC, OpenOffice.org, KDE, GNOME, Tomboy, F-Spot, Banshee, Beagle, (K)NetworkManager, Kickoff, Evolution, XEN, Xgl, and Compiz etc. Are you refusing to use any of those as well? Since they all have substantial amounts of Novell code."

http://en.opensuse.org/FAQ:Novell-MS#I_won..._support_Novell

Among others, Novell created XGL/Compiz, which accounts for 99% of the Ubuntu userbase. :(

 

they should, they don't really like linux like we do. for them its only compiz and I can bet majority of the people found out about ubuntu about the vista vs beryl video on youtube.

 

after compiz was released thats when majority of the linux users actually started coming in.

 

What he said.

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fatshitcat
fatshitcat
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Among others, Novell created XGL/Compiz, which accounts for 99% of the Ubuntu userbase.

You know that's not true.

 

Ubuntu has become popular when all this xgl/aiglx thing was considered too much for the regular user.

Ubuntu devs also contribute in OOO and especially in GNOME.

 

Big deal about Novell. Of course they contribute since Novell is a company and they get paid for this.

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Forceman
Forceman
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"The patent coverage does not give Novell any immunity from being sued for patent violations."

http://en.opensuse.org/FAQ:Novell-MS#But_t..._can_sue_others

It's all about the interoperability. It has nothing to do with patents or source code.

 

 

 

Your camp is the last one that needs to be complaining about using other products. Compiz+XGL, Ubuntu's pride and joy, and main source of userbase, was invented by...guess who?

 

 

 

"Novell has also created or is among the top sponsors of projects such as the Linux Kernel, GCC, OpenOffice.org, KDE, GNOME, Tomboy, F-Spot, Banshee, Beagle, (K)NetworkManager, Kickoff, Evolution, XEN, Xgl, and Compiz etc. Are you refusing to use any of those as well? Since they all have substantial amounts of Novell code."

http://en.opensuse.org/FAQ:Novell-MS#I_won..._support_Novell

Among others, Novell created XGL/Compiz, which accounts for 99% of the Ubuntu userbase. :unsure:

 

 

 

What he said.

 

Guess what, Ubuntu doesn't use XGL, it's another dead tech from Novell. Redhat did it proper. Guess what, they employed DavIdR the maker of compiz, he was doing that sort of thing before and they did it in secret.

 

Novell sponsor them projects, big deal, Redhat actually made quiet a few of them and you'll find that the mono apps are being replaced by C apps, Ubuntu dont even use Beagle and Banshee by default, they use Tracker and Rhythmbox. Yes so do alot of other people contribute do them, thats the whole idea, you silly Linux noob.

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snakeeyes
snakeeyes
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You know that's not true.

 

That is true, most of their users can't live without compiz almost everyone there is trying to set up compiz. I have friends who use ubuntu and if they can't setup compiz on another distro they don't even bother using it.

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Forceman
Forceman
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That is true, most of their users can't live without compiz almost everyone there is trying to set up compiz. I have friends who use ubuntu and if they can't setup compiz on another distro they don't even bother using it.

 

And OpenSUSE users dont as well?, you could have fooled me, how can they go to Ubuntu just for compiz when alot of other distros have it. It says alot for Ubuntu it's easier to setup. BTW does the nvidia settings still not work in XGL on SUSE, yep it still sucks and has them bugs.

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snakeeyes
snakeeyes
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And OpenSUSE users dont as well?, you could have fooled me, how can they go to Ubuntu just for compiz when alot of other distros have it.

 

Because most of youtube is filled with Ubuntu compiz videos rather than other distros, there r others but a majority r ubuntu's. If Ubuntu looses compiz then u can say bye bye to a huge amount of users there r, just see how they react to no compiz.

 

OpenSUSE users use compiz too, but there r many people who don't just like ubuntu has a few people who don't either. The thing is that ubuntu users r a majority of those people who came to linux for compiz, I can say that cause most of the people I know still think compiz is an ubuntu only thing and trust me I know loads of people who use linux.

 

Come on now, just because your friends use it because of it, it doesn't mean that most people do it that way.

If people can't get compiz on their system, they can always get vista if they use it only for the looks.

 

You see here is the problem if u r on any linux forums u will notice that most people coming to linux come from xp, and they want linux cause they have old out dated machines that can't support vista. In other words they r too greedy to actually buy a computer that may support vista or they may be poor.

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Forceman
Forceman
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Because most of youtube is filled with Ubuntu compiz videos rather than other distros, there r others but a majority r ubuntu's. If Ubuntu looses compiz then u can say bye bye to a huge amount of users there r, just see how they react to no compiz.OpenSUSE users use compiz too, but there r many people who don't just like ubuntu has a few people who don't either. The thing is that ubuntu users r a majority of those people who came to linux for compiz, I can say that cause most of the people I know still think compiz is an ubuntu only thing and trust me I know loads of people who use linux. You see here is the problem if u r on any linux forums u will notice that most people coming to linux come from xp, and they want linux cause they have old out dated machines that can't support vista. In other words they r too greedy to actually buy a computer that may support vista or they may be poor.
Yes because they are new and dont know how linux works, most of them think Ubuntu devs make gnome, how are they supposed to know otherwise. It's just like people think Microsoft made the first OS, people were using a mutitasking GUI way before WIndows came along, me being one of them. Linux is about sharing, no one took ideas from anyone because linux distros all drink from the same cup.
Great link, InorganicMatter.Only people blind or in bad faith can keep denying facts after reading that.
It's their opinion, it dont make it true, even Miguel voiced his concerns about the deal, Novell covered themselves not Linux there for partially admitting patent infringements. If they knew they were not they wouldn't have even made that part of the deal and after the deal is gone Microsoft can sue them anyway.
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Alessandro17
Alessandro17
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But this agreement means that Microsoft won't sue Novell, but it can sue others

 

No. The patent coverage does not give Novell any immunity from being sued for patent violations. In summary:

 

* Novell has no licence for Microsoft patents.

* Novell can’t use Microsoft patents (and vice versa)

* Novell can sue Microsoft for Novell patents in Microsoft products (and vice versa)

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snakeeyes
snakeeyes
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Yes because they are new and dont know how linux works, most of them think Ubuntu devs make gnome, how are they supposed to know otherwise. It's just like people think Microsoft made the first OS, people were using a mutitasking GUI way before WIndows came along, me being one of them. Linux is about sharing, no one took ideas from anyone because linux distros all drink from the same cup.

 

So in other words a majority of the people using ubuntu r stupid right? How dumb would u have to be to not know that all ubuntu devs do is take stuff other people make, add a couple of bugs to stable software and release it.

 

Yes they do add a lot of bugs, I remember having a bug on emerald with ubuntu gutsy on one machine for months and they wouldn't fix it. The bug was that whenever u press ALT+Tab emerald would crash, and if I remember correctly the devs didn't bother to fix the bug but instead they said they would make sure Hardy doesn't have it. So much for support, and oh yeah no other distro had that bug with the same version of compiz.

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Forceman
Forceman
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No, they have simply made a deal with them, with very clear conditions, covering a few specific areas.
Covenant not to sue each others _customers_ over patents.
:)
So in other words a majority of the people using ubuntu r stupid right? How dumb would u have to be to not know that all ubuntu devs do is take stuff other people make, add a couple of bugs to stable software and release it.Yes they do add a lot of bugs, I remember having a bug on emerald with ubuntu gutsy on one machine for months and they wouldn't fix it. The bug was that whenever u press ALT+Tab emerald would crash, and if I remember correctly the devs didn't bother to fix the bug but instead they said they would make sure Hardy doesn't have it. So much for support, and oh yeah no other distro had that bug with the same version of compiz.
OpenSUSE get them too, if they got all the XP users it would be the same, News flash: bugs yer OpenSUSE has them to, XGL being one.
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InorganicMatter
InorganicMatter
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And OpenSUSE users dont as well?, you could have fooled me, how can they go to Ubuntu just for compiz when alot of other distros have it. It says alot for Ubuntu it's easier to setup. BTW does the nvidia settings still not work in XGL on SUSE, yep it still sucks and has them bugs.

OpenSUSE users use the effects built into KDE4's Kwin. :)

 

And stop trying to downplay XGL+Compiz. XGL is still in heavy use, and to deny that Ubuntu would drown without compiz (another Novell project) is folly.

 

It sounds to me like someone is just bitter that their distro got left out in the cold when it comes to enterprise adoption...

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Forceman
Forceman
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OpenSUSE users use the effects built into KDE4's Kwin. :)

 

And stop trying to downplay XGL+Compiz. XGL is still in heavy use, and to deny that Ubuntu would drown without compiz (another Novell project) is folly.

 

It sounds to me like someone is just bitter that their distro got left out in the cold when it comes to enterprise adoption...

 

Are you for real?, noone else uses XGL, they use AIGLX which is part of Xorg. XGL is just a layer and something short term, Redhat did the proper job. So your saying that without compiz ubuntu wouldn't be popular?, thats utter nonsense, it would still be more popular than SUSE so just get over it.

 

BTW, SUSE had XGL and compiz first(because they developed it behind closed doors) and your saying that Ubuntu is only popular with it, sounds like a contradiction to me. All them users didn't flock to SUSE then because as I remember there was non stop amount of users in the IRC wanting to get XGL/Compiz working with SUSE at the time.

 

There goes your stupid argument about Ubuntu and Compiz.

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snakeeyes
snakeeyes
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Are you for real?, noone else uses XGL, they use AIGLX which is part of Xorg. XGL is just a layer and something short term, Redhat did the proper job. So your saying that without compiz ubuntu wouldn't be popular?, thats utter nonsense, it would still be more popular than SUSE so just get over it.

 

BTW, SUSE had XGL and compiz first(because they developed it behind closed doors) and your saying that Ubuntu is only popular with it, sounds like a contradiction to me. All them users didn't flock to SUSE then because as I remember there was no stop amount of users in the IRC wanting to get XGL/Compiz working.

 

There goes your stupid argument about Ubuntu and Compiz.

 

I don't know why XGL is being called so buggy, its not perfect but in the beginning it was required to give linux 3d effects and many ATI users still use it.

 

As for SUSE having compiz first, here is one reason I think Novell is really stupid. They never advertise what they make, they never do that. Thats the reason they don't get any reward for anything they do. If there is only one thing the Ubuntu devs do right is that they advertise every little thing they take as if they made it and only they have it. Ubuntu is good at doing marketing whereas SUSE isn't. Many people don't even know that Compiz was made by Novell. My argument is a fact and u r the stupid one here if u still don't get that if ubuntu had to remove compiz from it, then half of their users would move over to other distros.

 

I could place a bet on this that if ubuntu lost compiz it would loose more than half of its users. As for people who say ubuntu is easier, thats not true. SUSE, Mandriva, PCLinuxOS r all way easier but the one think they lack is fast package management which will be fixed in SUSE 11.

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fatshitcat
fatshitcat
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Ubuntu would drown without compiz (another Novell project) is folly.

What a silly thing.

 

Ubuntu has become popular before XGL+Compiz made it to mainstream. Don't deny it.

Other distros had compiz built in before ubuntu did it and they still didn't become so outrageously popular you would expect.

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