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8-core motherboard for hackintosh?


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jelle

The boards is really a good one belive me (even for other uses with other Linux OS's).

My config is 2 x 5440, Nvidia 8800GT, 5 SATA HD's, 4GBRAM.

 

I did'nt check Activity monitor but System Profiler is working for you? If not MAXCPU in BIOS must be disabled.

I'll let you know anyway.

 

Now on 82575EB: I'm in an early stage. I do have a problem which I cannot find, on the net, any help (this matter is really an hard one, belive me, and Apple has put out just a really poor documentaion and there are few examples).

I cannot unload the kext which bring the box to a kernel panic... also performance at the moment are REALLY poor (read it is not to use).

The chipset is really different from other Intel Ethernet chipset (82563EB is a good example) which are usually handled by propietary (ach... Apple NEVER released the source code, and people are really bad about it...) 8254x kext.

The 8255x kext is a good example but the chipset is really different and changing the code there breaks the box again... it was written at Next time on Intel 10/100 chipsets...

Even modding the 8254x Info.plist (ie inserting Device ID - 10a7 - and Vendor ID -8086) bring to an error in dmesg and in the logs and kext fails to link to the kernel, resulting in failing to use the chipset...

Anyway I'm using the Intel BSD driver as a starting point but this are some like 100K line of code to search in (it support any new Intel chipset).

What I'm basically wanna do is to have a working kext with only the basic stuff: not all the fancy things (link aggregation, power, etc.) the chipset can do.

 

Let you know any improvemente anyway.

To solve the LAN problem I have installed a Realtek PCI board with an 8269 chipset.

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Again on Asus DSEB-DG.

Thanks to the great Kabyl which has modded the board BIOS... (check http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?sho...&start=100) now I was able to have a perfect installation of this board.

 

Do not all 4-cores (x2) function out of the box, we'd have to mod the BIOS for all cores to work like they should? I'm abit confused about the mod post. Regardless, that looks like an excellent board, and many items seem functional out of the box like you've mentioned. Thanks for sharing -_-

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I'd just like to add a little Xserve IOReg goodness... courtesy of an Xserve Xeon.

 

Here is the boot drive:

 

 

| | | +-o AppleLSIFusionSAS <class AppleLSIFusionSAS, registered$

| | | | {

| | | | "IOMaximumSegmentByteCountWrite" = 16777200

| | | | "Write Time Out Duration" = 30000

| | | | "IOUnitName" = "disk"

| | | | "IOMaximumSegmentCountWrite" = 256

| | | | "CFBundleIdentifier" = "com.apple.driver.AppleLSIFusi$

| | | | "IOMatchCategory" = "IODefaultMatchCategory"

| | | | "IOMaximumSegmentAddressableBitCount" = 64

| | | | "Physical Interconnect Location" = "Internal"

| | | | "Read Time Out Duration" = 30000

| | | | "IOMaximumByteCountRead" = 16777215

| | | | "Protocol Characteristics" = {"Physical Interconnect"$

| | | | "IONameMatched" = "pci1000,50"

| | | | "IONameMatch" = ("LSILogic,sas","pci1000,50","pci1000$

| | | | "IOProbeScore" = 0

| | | | "IOMaximumSegmentCountRead" = 256

| | | | "Manages Targets" = Yes

| | | | "IOMinimumSegmentAlignmentByteCount" = 4

| | | | "Physical Interconnect" = "SAS"

| | | | "IOMaximumSegmentByteCountRead" = 16777200

| | | | "IOPowerManagement" = {"ChildrenPowerState"=1,"Curren$

| | | | "Controller Characteristics" = {"Vendor Name"="LSILog$

| | | | "IOProviderClass" = "IOPCIDevice"

| | | | "SCSI Initiator Identifier" = 169

| | | | "IOMaximumByteCountWrite" = 16777215

| | | | "IOClass" = "AppleLSIFusionSAS"

| | | | }

| | | |

 

 

Little research shows that its an LSI 1068E SAS controller.... Stock Xserve Xeon 2.8ghz, 4 cores.

 

OSX Server 10.5.2

 

This thing rocks.

 

Now I just need to get more parts so I can get an 8 core box at home......

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jelleThe boards is really a good one belive me (even for other uses with other Linux OS's).My config is 2 x 5440, Nvidia 8800GT, 5 SATA HD's, 4GBRAM.
great to hear you think so too Karterilla.happy to hear from someone running the same hardware!
I did'nt check Activity monitor but System Profiler is working for you? If not MAXCPU in BIOS must be disabled.I'll let you know anyway.
I checked my bios with the MAXCPU hint, but the only thing that I found that might be related was a "max CPUID" setting that was already disabled. Is that what you meant? System profiler does show up, though memory, pci cards, do not show up.Is the Activity Monitor working well on your machine?And how about sleep, is that working well for you? It does work on my setup, but not that stable, trying to resolve that right now.
Now on 82575EB: I'm in an early stage.
well, I'm impressed that you have the will to resolve this!more power to you Karterilla!
Anyway I'm using the Intel BSD driver as a starting point but this are some like 100K line of code to search in (it support any new Intel chipset).What I'm basically wanna do is to have a working kext with only the basic stuff: not all the fancy things (link aggregation, power, etc.) the chipset can do.
Sound like you found yourself a _true_ challenge!I'm curious to hear how this project will progress
Let you know any improvemente anyway.
much appreciated!
To solve the LAN problem I have installed a Realtek PCI board with an 8269 chipset.
that's exactly what i did
Little research shows that its an LSI 1068E SAS controller.... Stock Xserve Xeon 2.8ghz, 4 cores.
hi Vlad,so basically what your saying is that the RAID on my supermicro 7045A-WTB is well supported?well that just _makes my day_!that fantastic news!!!thanks so much for sharing!i'm so happy to hear that apperently the 7045A-WTB / X7DWA-N is such a good choice.seems like a nice mash up of mac pro + xserve goodness!
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So you're saying that if I was to get an LSI Logic SAS3442E-R that it would support

a boot drive in my Hack? I'd love to use a nice fast 15K SAS HDD as my boot drive :thumbsup_anim:

 

I know Leo has a MegaRAID.kext & LSIUltra320.kext but I'm assuming OS X Server has

a LSI SAS kext that I would need?

 

Can you confirm that???

 

I'd just like to add a little Xserve IOReg goodness... courtesy of an Xserve Xeon.

 

Here is the boot drive:

| | | +-o AppleLSIFusionSAS <class AppleLSIFusionSAS, registered$

| | | | {

| | | | "IOMaximumSegmentByteCountWrite" = 16777200

| | | | "Write Time Out Duration" = 30000

| | | | "IOUnitName" = "disk"

| | | | "IOMaximumSegmentCountWrite" = 256

| | | | "CFBundleIdentifier" = "com.apple.driver.AppleLSIFusi$

| | | | "IOMatchCategory" = "IODefaultMatchCategory"

| | | | "IOMaximumSegmentAddressableBitCount" = 64

| | | | "Physical Interconnect Location" = "Internal"

| | | | "Read Time Out Duration" = 30000

| | | | "IOMaximumByteCountRead" = 16777215

| | | | "Protocol Characteristics" = {"Physical Interconnect"$

| | | | "IONameMatched" = "pci1000,50"

| | | | "IONameMatch" = ("LSILogic,sas","pci1000,50","pci1000$

| | | | "IOProbeScore" = 0

| | | | "IOMaximumSegmentCountRead" = 256

| | | | "Manages Targets" = Yes

| | | | "IOMinimumSegmentAlignmentByteCount" = 4

| | | | "Physical Interconnect" = "SAS"

| | | | "IOMaximumSegmentByteCountRead" = 16777200

| | | | "IOPowerManagement" = {"ChildrenPowerState"=1,"Curren$

| | | | "Controller Characteristics" = {"Vendor Name"="LSILog$

| | | | "IOProviderClass" = "IOPCIDevice"

| | | | "SCSI Initiator Identifier" = 169

| | | | "IOMaximumByteCountWrite" = 16777215

| | | | "IOClass" = "AppleLSIFusionSAS"

| | | | }

| | | |

Little research shows that its an LSI 1068E SAS controller.... Stock Xserve Xeon 2.8ghz, 4 cores.

 

OSX Server 10.5.2

 

This thing rocks.

 

Now I just need to get more parts so I can get an 8 core box at home......

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So you're saying that if I was to get an LSI Logic SAS3442E-R that it would support

a boot drive in my Hack? I'd love to use a nice fast 15K SAS HDD as my boot drive :D

 

I know Leo has a MegaRAID.kext & LSIUltra320.kext but I'm assuming OS X Server has

a LSI SAS kext that I would need?

 

Can you confirm that???

 

Well, no, since actually I was asking this to _you_ :)

A very promising thought nevertheless!

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LOL!

 

Actually, thanks to "The other vlad" & his IOREG, I found the AppleLSIFusionMPT.kext :)

Looking inside the info.plist shows support for SAS :D

 

My only concern is - does the Mac Pro RAID SAS card have an internal connector?

Reason I ask is, I'd like to use the internal connector on the SAS3442E-R & if Apple's card doesn't have one,

will the driver recognize the internal connector on the SAS3442E-R???

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LOL!

 

Actually, thanks to "The other vlad" & his IOREG, I found the AppleLSIFusionMPT.kext :)

Looking inside the info.plist shows support for SAS :D

 

oops, my bad, I was mixing you guys up!

 

My only concern is - does the Mac Pro RAID SAS card have an internal connector?

Reason I ask is, I'd like to use the internal connector on the SAS3442E-R & if Apple's card doesn't have one,

will the driver recognize the internal connector on the SAS3442E-R???

 

frankly, I wouldnt know...

very interesting question however

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Thanks - Do you have any benchmarks?

 

Supported SAS PCI-Express Cards: http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?showtopic=94679

 

My ATTO ExpressSAS H308 boots and works well with my 300gb SAS Seagate Cheetah 15K.5 (been on it for a month now)

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Hi Majestik,

 

If you go through this thread you're bound to find at least a few.

I've got a supermicro X7DWA-N that really is very close to a Mac Pro and can recommend it to you.

In the thread a Tyan and Asus are mentioned as well.

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LSI SCSI, Fiberchannel, and SAS are all run by the same driver now.... the FusionMPT driver..... Apple took advantage of this back in the early Xserve days... with the LSI Ultra320 SCSI card, and the LSI fiberchannel cards.

 

Now, they're doing onboard LSI SAS in the Xserve Xeon, and offering LSI Fiberchannel cards, and LSI U320 with the PCI-X riser option....

 

 

now, I don't know if the OSX Server version of the LSI extensions are different..... might investigate.

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LSI SCSI, Fiberchannel, and SAS are all run by the same driver now.... the FusionMPT driver..... Apple took advantage of this back in the early Xserve days... with the LSI Ultra320 SCSI card, and the LSI fiberchannel cards.

 

Now, they're doing onboard LSI SAS in the Xserve Xeon, and offering LSI Fiberchannel cards, and LSI U320 with the PCI-X riser option....

now, I don't know if the OSX Server version of the LSI extensions are different..... might investigate.

 

That's very interesting info Vlad, please keep us posted on any advance in this direction!

 

Best,

 

-jelle

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Jelle:

I did try Activity monitor and for me is working... I do have a vanilla everything (but dsmos) 10.5.2 (which anyway really stink compoared to 10.5.1, I'm trying 10.5.3 build 9D12 to solve problems the current release has... even on real Macs (MPs and Imacs).

 

About sleep: I always disable in Energy Saver, "computer to sleep..." and "HDs sleep when possible", even on real Macs. This have always brought me to frezees... for example getting in back to work the morning after.

So sleep I did'nt deeply check: I've just put it to sleep a coupple of times to just give it a try and just got it back...

 

LAN it is really a REAL challange... need to work it a lot and THIS is the problem: ie find time to do it...

If I will be able to have something close to a working thing whitout breaking your box I'll let you try it.

 

BIOS settings: sorry to many BIOS setting on different systems daily :wacko:

Yes the setting is MAX CPUID which on other AMI or Phoenix is called MAXCPU... sorry about it...

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With 2 5450 Xeons the boards really screams... but it is really worth the effort? I've tryed a little overclocking... and is working great too!

 

I wanted to ask how you overclock this board. Is that through the hacked bios, or software based?

 

I also wanted to ask what type of ram you have? With Snoop Filter off, I have Prime95 crashing with high FFTs with 667mhz FB-Dimm and 2x e5450 cpus.

 

Also, with Snoop Filter enabled, the computer is super slow with cpu intensive programs :)

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Snoop filter is built into northbridge to reduce cache misses to some extent.

 

Basically... if you have two 5450's... you have 4 core2 duo's... each with 6mb shared L2.

 

 

Core2 A (Cores 1/2)

Core2 B (Cores 3/4)

 

Core2 C (Cores 5/6)

Core2 D (Cores 7/8)

 

A and B are under the same heat spreader in one socket..... C and D in the other socket.

 

Since Cores 1 and 2 share the same cache..... but do NOT share the cache with the other 6 cores.... if Core 3 wanted data that was in Core 1/2's L2 cache.... without a snoop filter it would have to hit main memory. With the snoop filter, it gets the info from Cores 1/2 via the FSB.

 

But if core 5 wanted the data... now Core5 talks to northbridge over the 2nd FSB (in socket 771 chipsets, each socket has its own front side bus) and northbridge gets the data from Cores1/2 over the 1st FSB, and sends it back over the 2nd FSB to core5..... and you've added significant latency.... hit both busses twice.... and NOT hit main memory. SO... depending on memory load.... on some code the snoop filter actually is a penalty. In most cases, I've heard its good for 5-10% performance.

 

Now, since the real mac pro has a snoop filter... being based on the 5000x and 5400 chipsets.... disabling snoop filter could be a real problem, since now you might get into code that assumes the snoop filter is there, and run into a coherency problem, where with snoop disabled, it gets the data out of ram after it had been changed in L2 cache on the other processor.... could possibly cause kernel panics.

 

It could also possibly cause problems then in 4 core single socket systems, since they don't have a snoop filter either.

 

Now, with your snoop filter turned on in single threaded performance, are you seeing real slowdowns, or are you just seeing extra load on the other cores? What about in two threaded performance?

 

Are these slowdowns in real applications, or just in CPU flogging programs designed to just thrash the processor?

 

You might try running the distributed.net client and run through its benchmarking program with snoop disabled..... and with it on. You might also try setting the number of parallel threads it spawns as well, and re-investigate.

 

EDIT: I wonder if you might be thermal throttling the processors as well, or the ram? FB-DIMM's will throttle themselves at high heat, and so will your processors. Might try directing some extra cooling across the FB-DIMM's if they aren't currently actively cooled.

 

 

As far as overclocking Xeons, very few boards offer real overclocking support. Intel's Skulltrail board does. A few of the Asus Xeon boards have had some basic overclocking... but nothing to write home about.

 

The simplest Xeon overclocks are really just BSEL mod's.... you basically put a tiny tiny tiny piece of tape over one or more of the spots on the bottom of the chip... blocking the connection for that "pin" and in some cases, you also add a tiny tiny tiny wire to add a connection to another pin. This then tricks the motherboard into thinking the processor wants a higher FSB.... and then you just jumped an entire FSB category.

 

For example, if you take a 1333 mhz FSB 5430 (2.66 ghz) and BSEL mod it to 1600 FSB.... now it'll run at 3.2 ghz... and make a {censored}ton more heat and likely require a higher voltage. (Get out the tape spots and wires again to hardmod it to trick the board into sending more voltage.....) Overclocking Xeon's isn't nearly as painless or as easy or as without risks as overclocking desktop chips.

 

Now.... engineering sample versions of the chips.... don't have locked multipliers, and thus you can change multiplier in bios on some boards. OR, you could run a hacked bios. Yeah.... Not sure I'm willing to flash the bios chip on an expencive board just to get a few more overclocking features.

 

You can also software overclock using programs like systool in windows, but I haven't seen anything of the sort for OSX yet, and frankly, I'm not sure I completely trust software messing around with vital hardware settings like that. ESPECIALLY not on an expencive board with expencive processors.

 

I've seen reports of people cranking their 5400 series Xeon's up into the mid 3 ghz range, but at a cost of some serious heat and more voltage required. Also means you're going to have to buy faster ram in many cases.

 

Also, double check to make sure the board supports the higher FSB beforehand.... not all 5400 chipset boards can run the 800mhz FB-DIMM or 1600 FSB.... A few of the supermicro boards can, as can the Tyan 5397. Not sure any of the other Tyan's can... Haven't really looked into the Asus boards. From what i've heard, the ASUS Xeon boards haven't been terribly reliable, and are more suited as rich gamer boards.

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Are these slowdowns in real applications, or just in CPU flogging programs designed to just thrash the processor?

 

When I first got the board I installed XP 32bit on it, and tested it with Cinebench r10 and Prime95. With snoop filter on, both these test programs were going very very slow. From what I remember, i was scoring about 7 to 9000 in cinebench with snoop filter on, and about 21000 with snoop filter off. Running Prime95 was the same result.

 

I've also ran SuperPi (single threaded), and it was slower than my laptop (T7200, Core 2 Duo 2.0ghz) with Snoop Filter Enabled.

 

with Snoop filter off, my 667mhz FB-dimms crash in high FFTs with Prime95. Using hwmonitor, the temps of FB-dimms maxes out around 96 degrees, cpus are usually max out at 65 degrees.

 

Now, the funny thing is, I put in one 800mhz MacPro FBDimm (made by Hynix), and Prime95 ran perfectly fine. I put back just one 667mhz FBdimm, and it crashes Prime95 again. (different brands of ram too)

 

It also crossed my mind the Snoop Filter thermally controlled the Ram or cpus.

 

Anyhow, I'm probably changing the board to an Asus z7s and use the DSEB-DG to create a Fibre Channel SAN.

 

I got this setup because, I needed a fast rendering machine to take advantage of all cores.

 

Oh yeah, i know about the BSEL mod, and how easy it is to just cover one of the pins to give the cpus 1600FSB, but I didn't want to use a conductive pen to adjust the voltage on a couple of $1000 cpus to support the extra FSB.

 

I have an e3110 in another system, I needed to set the voltage to 1.32v to run the cpu at 4050mhz perfectly stable. I figured, I'd need to get the e5450 up to 1.25v to run it perfectly stable at 3.6ghz

 

I was asking because of the modded bios for the DSEB-DG board, and maybe the hacker put in some extra features. I rather put the risk into a $500 motherboard than $2000 worth of cpus.

 

Either way, i am replacing the DSEB-DG with the Asus z7s because of the lack of Power Management features. I'll use the DSEB-DG to build a Fibre Channel SAN.

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redmodel,

my "overclocking" (sorry for the misunderstanding) means playing with different BIOS config (the one permitted by the BIOS which it is not too much considering this is a server board).

I've played with north bridge and south bridge different configs and the MoBo still working under any different configs.

 

I'll try (whenever I have time...) the RAID config on both controller and post results.

 

 

My RAM is 2 Kingnston KVR667D2D8F5/2G.

 

Do you have an Asus DSEB-DG?

 

I've added an extra cheap (18$) C-Media 8738 audio board (I'd to recompile the "old" kext otherwise no way) and a 1394b board (I took it away from an old G5) and the thing now can be used as desktop box.

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Hi Karterilla,

 

Yeah I have a DSEB-DG board right now too. The same board where I've had to disable Snoop Filter because it slows down any CPU intensive program, and crashes with 667mhz FB-DIMMS in Prime95 with High FFT settings (under windows OS).

 

What I did was got a combo FW400/FW800/USB PCI card, and plugged in a E-MU 0404 external soundcard. This is a great great soundcard that can be found for cheap on ebay. I highly recommend it.

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redmodel,

I do have Snoop Filter enabled. I do not use Prime95. It is enough the 2 Xeon 5450s at least for me...

Do you have AHCI enbled? I do.

 

Even if with this config I'm unable to use Vista or Linux (ie I've to reverse to IDE) already installed neither a SATA DVD.

 

If you want I can send you BIOS conf at least for things you need to compare.

 

Do you have downloaded mod BIOS from kabyl? great job even looking at his thread...

 

Yes I can belive audio is real good for you: I've my (junk) one spare from old PCs and I know I could use it. Only stereo anyway no 5:1.

 

Anyway I have this ASUS board spare fro server usage, and I gave it a try but poor support (real poor I've written half a dozen mailsto thei support, with just no answer... and I'm not talking of hackintosh suff but simply boot Windoze or Linux from an Asus (!) SATA DVD...). No way if you use AHCI (which in many other Asusu boards/AMI BIOS works like a charm...).

But I really prefer for daily use the Supermicro one (which is also cheaper compare to this one...).

No sound, only 2 USB ports, no 1394, problems in booting and since the kabyl work no way to use it with Mac OS...

 

Anyway we have now a working mobo...

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I'll be installing the custom bios later on today.

 

Yeah, the official bios is a bit messed up, and you can't really boot off SATA drives when the AHCI is enabled.

 

Apparently it seems to be a common issues with some boards. OR, maybe more to do with the actual dvd drive. i haven't really looked into it closely enough.

 

But there's an easy workaround in Windows systems. Just install Vista or XP in IDE mode. After Installation, go to Device Manager and update the drivers of the Intel IDE controller to the Intel AHCI driver.

 

Restart the computer, change to AHCI mode in the bios, and start up windows. Windows should start up perfectly fine.

 

Not sure if the same trick can be applied to linux.

 

I totally agree that Asus' support has been just absolutely terrible. They just send you back automated messages to deal with their desktop boards.

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At least you receive an automated mail: not for me.. just ignore mails at all...

 

The SATA DVD (Asus again...) is working perfectly with at least their desktop motherboards (I've trayed with all P5x-.. mobos (C,K, E, EPro, EPro WiFI) Blitz and some older one.

 

All install perfectly with AMI BIOS and AHCI on (not talking of Windoze or Linux but Tiger or Leo).

 

Is just this BIOS/MoBo combination which really suck...

 

What seems promising, and I would like to know if someone has tryied in deep yet, is the new skulltrail Z7S WS, someone already mentioned here.

Is more a desktop than a server MoBo with modding in BIOS and all what is needed for workstation/desktop use.

 

On DSEB-DG I've connected all 4 Eths and seems there is a problem with all the 4 ports connected: en3 if en4 is connected (and both configured) does not work (10.5.2 vanilla IONetworkingFamily and AppleIntel8254x kext).

This is strange since these are 2 different chipsets (one is 82563EB while the other is an 82573) each with 2 ports.

 

I have to take a look deeply into log and registers to understand why only port 3 it is not working while on same chipset is working.

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I think I'm settling for Z7S WS as well...unless Intel releases a CEB/ATX Form Factor with Dual-CPU sockets, I guess I can wait. And I know overclocking is not a major concern wit h these 8-core, I never have before, but I've read that the ASUS DSEB overclocked super well and there is much anticipation for th Z7S. Anyway, I understand ASUS aren't really much of a server/workstation-oriented boards compared to the TYAN and Supermicro, like vlad mentioned.

 

To the other vlad:

Thanks - Do you have any benchmarks?

 

No. I don't. You should really read a bit more on the links you're referring to. One of the links in your thread discusses mini-SAS, the connector, being tested with 4x SATA Hard drives, no SAS hard drives are present, so that wouldn't actually be a SAS benchmark. [Highpoint RocketRAIDs are not SAS controllers, their primary focus are multiple SATAs in RAID-arrays, they are intended for SATA, and use the mini-SAS connector, which is commonly used for multilane cables to SATA drives] Also, there's a difference between SAS via External vs. internal solutions, primary vs. secondary, scratch, etc... purposes are distinctive as well, as you can see it can break-down to specifics. Certainly there is a lot to consider. You're asking all these questions, you should really just try it already, or settle for SATA arrays. Knowing that there aren't that many SAS users in this community, you might want to try others. It ma

 be a costly investment, but it really comes down to what you're using the hard drive for.  Let's try not to go off-topic on this thread, there are plenty of threads about this.

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I don't know why people are saying that the mac pro is such a good deal. If you ignore the currently artificially high margin of the 2.8ghz quad xeons and get the more reasonable 2.5Ghz quad xeons at half the price, you get this:

 

Western Digital Caviar SE WD5000AAJS 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM

$89.99

 

ASUS DSAN-DX Dual LGA 771 Intel 5100 SSI CEB Server Motherboard - Retail

$299.99 (can take a x16 ePCI card)

 

Intel Xeon E5420 Harpertown 2.5GHz LGA 771 80W Quad-Core Processor Model BX80574E5420A - Retail

$349.99 *2 = 700

 

Transcend 2GB 240-Pin DDR2 FB-DIMM DDR2 667 (PC2 5300) ECC Fully Buffered Server Memory Model TS256MFB72V6U-T - Retail

$65.99 (up to 6 sticks of ram), add $80 if you want the 800Mhz version

 

MSI NX8800GTS 320M OC GeForce 8800GTS 320MB 320-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - Retail

$139.99

 

= 1300 + 200 for the case, powersupply, keyboard & mouse, DVD drive, external sound card. = 1500, half the price of the mac pro!

 

(also i don't know what's the fascination with skulltrail, it seems your still limited to the same dopey 4 RAM slots. SLI, maybe? [but the mac pro even doesn't offer sli, its cheapo radeons are probably @ special ePCI 8x speeds])

(another nice thing about macs is that they don't have the artificial distinction between the pro & consumer video cards, letting you have all the features!)

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(another nice thing about macs is that they don't have the artificial distinction between the pro & consumer video cards, letting you have all the features!

 

What programs are there on the MAC that don't require a professional 3D card, and do on a Windows Based System?

 

Also, i think you're better off spending the couple of hundred extra on the z7s and overclocking the the e5420 to 3.0ghz.

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