Hackitosh Vs. Macintosh

[sneezymarble]

According to Geekbench x64 and x86, the system in my sig outperforms the current quad core Mac Pro with 8GB of ram. It cost me $1200 to build that system. On the other hand, a quad core Mac Pro with 8GB and an 8800GT (less powerful video card with less ram) goes for $3949 according to Apple's website right now. The choice is pretty simple as far as I'm concerned.

 

What's even more is that I can softmod my GTX such that it essentially becomes a 768MB QuadroFX. You can only get a 1.5GB QuadroFX from Apple and that will run you an additional $2700. A softmodded g80 GTX will perform the same as a authentic QuadroFX. Obviously performance will be affected once the video memory is all used up but until it does a 1.5GB Quadro and a 768MB Quadro will perform the same. In CAD and 3D modeling/animation programs a modded g80 and an actual Quadro g80 will absolutely run circles around the best non-workstation class graphics card Apple offers in their Mac Pro line.

 

So, let's assume Apple offered an authentic 768MB QuadroFX g80. Also, let's assume that Apple would, as they do with the QuadroFX they actually offer, charge retail price for it. It would roughly cost $1200. So subtracting the $150 from $3949 for the 8800GT and adding $1200 for a 768MB g80 Quadro we get $4999.

 

Conclusion, my $1200 Hack Pro performs at least as good as a $5000 Mac Pro.

 

You might say, "well, Mac Pros are using more dependable and higher quality server components." You'd be right. But there still remains an enormous price difference. A quick hop around newegg will show that for $7912.87 I could have a dual 771 server board with an 8 core 4x2 Harpertown 3.0Ghz configuration, with 32GB of ram, a QuadroFX 5600, 2x1TB Seagate Barracudas, Lightscribe DVDRW burner, 1000W Antec PSU, SuperMicro Workstation chasis, wireless KB/M, and a retail copy of Leopard 10.5.1. How much does a system cost from Apple with those exact same specs? $16349!

[gizmoarena]

1. OS X on P4 PC!

2. No Apple outlets here!

3. In my country, US$ 1 = 72 local currency. Plus shipping charge!

4. My PC is way faster and easily upgradable comparing to macbooks I have tried.

[squirtle]

I sell macs for a (pseudo)living.

 

I guess for me the reason not to buy a new mac is for $1100 you get a small screen notebook with 1GB RAM and 120 GB hard drive. Yes it's beautifully made and a wonderful OS. But no matter what OS you run, mp3, jpeg, and .avi are the same size. It's inadequate to the task -- whereas I can get another brand at that price with 3G RAM/250GB hard drive, and in any screen size I want. With the laptops, the mini, and the pro there's other products that you get more machine for the same money.

 

For someone in sales, the issue of money in mac vs windows is really irrelevant -- much like if you sold Lexus vs Subaru or worked at nice restaurant vs fastfood. It's the customer's money, so they get to decide if they want fancy vs fastfood.

 

But the reason to hackintosh vs the reasons not to buy a mac are two completely different things.

 

Hackintosh it's more the difference between buying a loaf of bread vs baking your own.

[patsphone2]

Umm, because it's fun to build a hackintosh and have it actually work.

[globilux]

I'm using (trying to use) Hackintosh (even if I have a mac) :

 

- Because I think Apple licensing is out of minding (obliged to buy a mac to isntall mac, it's illegal in france)

- Because I love OS X

- Because I like the forbidden thing

- To experiment

- And because it's cheaper (very much)

[Wolfie]

Because My Hackintosh is faster than my PowerBook and because I already had my tower before I though about putting Leopard on it

[dvdivx]

Basically a hackintosh is what you get when you are poor. A macbook pro would be $1000 more than the Vostro I have now for the same specs and a worse warranty. That being said the osx86 is worse than windows me or Vista. Just to get security updates will take many formats (30+ already) no help (plenty of 0 reply posts) and a complete waste of time. So that's what it boils down to. How much or how little is your time worth. For example out of 6 versions of 10.5 only one boots my Vostro at all. (iatkos v2) but won't allow usb or firewire mounted hdds so no time machine for me. With a macbook pro that wouldn't be a problem. If it was I'd get a different one under warranty. Sure 0sx86 might work for some when you follow the directions posted but sometimes it won't. You are just gambling that you are in the will work category. You also have to factor in how valuable your time is. Because it will take a long time and much frustration just to get anything to work and forget about being up to date on security.

[knewsom]

My hackintosh was purpose-built, and so far ONLY runs Leopard, and no other OS. I'm considering a windows install on a second hard drive just for games that I can't get for Mac, like Total War.

 

I decided to get a hackintosh because I was using a dual 2.0 G5, and felt it was definitely getting to be time for an intel based mac, but needed something that was going to meet my needs (I'm an editor) - a MacMini certainly wasn't going to, nor was an iMac, and a MacPro was WAY out of my price-range, not just a little bit out, a LOT bit out. So I did some research and found that I could wind up spending about 100 bux more than I could sell my G5 for, and wind up with a pretty top-shelf hackintosh that was as fast if not faster than the low-end Mac Pro!

 

In the end, it was simple math and necessity, the fun of building it and getting it to work right was just a bonus, though I've often found that bread you bake yourself is usually the more tasty, and that applies to nearly everything in this world. I love apple, but they have a MASSIVE gap in their product lineup. If they had offered a computer that met my needs for even 500 bux more than I paid for my setup, you'd better believe I'd have bought it. They simply just don't offer what I need/can afford. Furthermore, remember that brand-loyalty can by definition only be a one-way street. Corporations are NOT PEOPLE and don't deserve our loyalty. As consumers, our duty is to make socially and environmentally conscious purchases instead of the alternative as often as possible, and in conjunction with that, to use our dollar signs to equate the highest possible consumer benefit with the lowest expenditure. If apple sees the signs, they will adapt, though I believe they're one step of the game, as usual, and are allowing this movement to serve their purposes - free advertisement and the realization that the Mac OS is a very real and very good solution for the vast majority of computing needs. Why did windows become so dominant? Because Microsoft allowed anyone to pirate it and copy it and install it at will on a huge variety of computers. Now Apple's turning the tables.

[apowerr]

Mac desktops aren't upgradeable, expandable and are way to expensive. A hackintosh works just as good and you can build it yourself for a lot less.

[Zaap]

To me, Hackintosh vs. Macintosh is the same choice as a DIY PC vs. a Dell or a Gateway. Some people like things pre-assembed with someone else's corporate logo and their set way of doing things stamped all over the thing, and others of us are Do-It-Yourself types.

 

Being a DIY'r, I've always prefered to spec out and build my own PCs. I don't want Dell, Apple, or anyone else limiting my choices. It's no mystery to me what's inside the case, so I want parts I've picked out myself, and that I know are the best bang for the buck.

 

It amazes me when people say things like "Apple makes both the hardware and the software yada yada yada corporate spin bullcrap." No they don't. Apple doesn't make one damn thing inside their boxes, it's just a collection of third party parts like any other PC maker, crammed inside a botique case. They just have a much more narrow range of hardware supported out of the box- which sounds sorta nifty I guess, until you actually need a driver for something outside the Apple radar and come to the realization that actually, Apple isn't anywhere near as plug-and-play as their fans pretend.

 

Half the time, the upgrade options of actual Apple wares are pathetic, if they even exist. Only a $3,000 MacPro even has standard upgrade slots and full-size/speed drives. Intel makes the processors. Foxconn or someone else makes the mobos. Nvidia or ATI makes the graphics hardware. Crucial or someone else makes the RAM, Seagate, WD, Pioneer or whoever else the drives. None of it is hardware from the magic Apple fairy in Cupportino.

 

Recently when I really needed a decent mid-tower Mac at home to do editing work with, there was no way I wouldn't have considered a Hackintosh build first and foremost. If Apple made a decent mid tower, I might consider it, but only if there was no viable build option. The simple fact is, I physically can't do my work any faster with a $3,000 MacPro, vs. the $900 Hackintosh I just built- the speed is no longer a hardware limitation, just the natural limits of human user input- so why would I want the MacPro? Because it's "official"? As long as my work gets done, I don't care.

[megatran808]

For bragging rights to our other Mac friends that spent $$$ on their mac when we were able to install it on our regular PC's that is half the cost.

[Torretto]

I am also in the price category. If i had $2200 CDN, i would be at Best Buy to buy a Mac Pro in like 3 seconds, but the fact of the matter is, my HackBook Pro has similar specs (in the areas i actually care about) to the lowest end MacBook Pro, and I could buy nearly 5 of this laptop ($450 CDN) for the price of the lowest end MacBook Pro ($2149 CDN). Yeah, it's a no brainer.

 

But yes, i would sell my soul, my car, and all 3 of my PC's for a MacBook Pro.

 

Stupid Apple tax which is about twice as much here in Canada as in USA.

[LogicalUser]

definitely price. a Mac Pro starts at $2800 canadian, and by the time i'm piecing my new hackintosh together i'll be looking at around $800-900, and the hack comes with a much better graphics card, and lots more RAM.

[d!g!t@lTr@sh]

Because Hacintosh is for the rest of us™ and Macs are not. --Well said!

 

If apple were to start releasing OSX for PC's, I'd buy it instead of M$'s {censored}.

 

I own a 533mhz G4 for 7 years now. Spent 2K for it back then. Now I have a 2.4ghz Intel notebook running osx/vista in parallel. Spent $0 for the mac part of it.

 

Aside from these, the REAL reason is of course because its cool. The joy of getting it to run on your hardware is aberantly empowering.

[starfox5194]

ok, because it costs too much is a load of B*** S***

 

I understand that a mac may be a little more than a pc in some countries, but come on HACKintosh hello! HACK!

 

Why do people hack their psp? It is fun! Why do *some* people make viruses? They Enjoy the fact that they can!

 

Why do YOU play video games? because you find joy it it... I'm not trying to beat down your question, but the the real reason is because people take pride in their accomplishments!

 

Running mac is a pc is cool, because you have something that other people don't, mac on a PC.

 

It isn't because it is cheaper of free, if it is, you should be ashamed of yourself. Hacking is something that people take pride in...

[chrisdarl]

I've no previous experience of Mac, before starting to hack my Laptop.. I didn't want to spend nearly £2,000 on a Macbook Pro, and find out I didn't like using Mac OS. Once I'm comfortable using Mac daily, I'll purchase a real Mac.

[hecker]

As a response to the OP: What's the point?

The point, at least to me, was to get rid of Windows (ie. the virus sandbox) without having to spend a small fortune for a new PC and at the same time test-run OS X which lead to my buying a real Mac (MacBook) after about a year.

 

Cheers,

 

- hecker

[eric470]

Just to see if it works. And holy {censored} it works! Video, audio, network. It's beautiful.

[hnzw_rui]

As with others, just to see if it works. I was also getting bored and in my search for all things (Intel) Atom-related, I came across a blog post detailing how to run OSx86 on hardware very similar to mine.

 

Another reason is I wanted to preview Mac OS X before I commit myself to buying a Mac. I can easily afford one and I've been considering buying an iMac for a long time. However, the 30 mins~1 hr spent playing with Macs in the Apple store every now and then hasn't really given me a feel for the OS. It just left me feeling frustrated at being unable to do what I can easily accomplish in Windows. I've been a Windows user for around 15 years and despite claims about how revolutionary Mac OS is and how much easier it is to use than Windows, familiarity with an OS can make a big impact on the user experience. The hackintosh lets me test OS X at my leisure in the comfort of my own home. I'm still learning the ropes and right now, I often find myself reaching for the button on the KVM (my "HackMini" sits atop my regular midtower desktop) so I can switch to Windows XP when I need to get something done. Maybe in time, as I gain more familiarity with OS X, that will change. We'll see...

[designlord]

As I read on emulators.com regarding this years MacExpo:

 

"But once the economy went south, Apple did not lower prices. I purchased the Gateway FX notebook in October for about $1200, less than half of a comparably equipped Macbook Pro. Around the same time Apple launched new models of notebooks without much regard to affordability. Steve Jobs didn't impress when he made statements along the lines of Apple not knowing how to make a good 500 dollar notebook and that they don't make computers for people who fly economy class."

 

I fly economy. I build my own PCs, like my Quad Core w/ 24" monitor for under 1k. Mac Pro with the same specs , minus the monitor and a GPU card that is 2 years old: $3049!!

 

Macs are over priced and have no performance GPU solution. This pricing is a bad choice since they could put out "pseudo-cloud" OS that could run on PC's for $300-400 bucks and likely make more given the margin on computers. Plus, they could make a killing on cases and those accessories to give that "apple touch".

 

Aside from price, it is a part of the challenge. I'm a geek. Also, I have been developing games for Windows and the market on Apple is something I wanted to target since I saw this swell in popularity coming a few years back. But 3k pays for 1/4 of my art assets, and from a business point of view alone it doesn't make sense, but hey my company doesn't have a private jet.

 

Just like {censored} DMR on games (I'm looking at you Epic... a hard kill date on a product a customer buys!! WTF), Apple needs to provide a mid-level Dual/Quad core, 2GB Ram, Radeon 4850 for about 1k. I could justify spending an extra $500 to by a monitor and the price would be Windows competitive if I didn't build my own.

 

In the meantime I'll use my PURCHASED (if you can't afford $125 bucks you might be a lying thief, and should have the balls to walk into a BestBuy and steal if in a way that has some real risks, or get another job) copy of OS X on my PC until development is far enough along that I'll be able to make a ROI for a Mac.

 

Anyways, here is to Steve Jobs and Apple's future, because my dad died of what is going to kill Steve

[JohnnyAppleseed]

Dear MacVertigo and other InsanelyMac members,

 

I think what is important to remember here is that the folks who spend money to buy Macs and OS X (any flavor) have heard that everything works right out of the box (remember the 'I'm a Mac, I'm a PC' commercial about working right out of the box?), and there is an undeniable COOL factor as well, which outweighs cost considerations.

 

The folks who are members of InsanelyMac.com and/or The OSx86 Project have another consideration entirely - the challenge of seeing whether they can get Mac OS X (again, any flavor, but maximum bragging rights to those getting the latest version) to run on x86-based / AMD-based computers. This is different from most virus/malware authors, because the person who makes it work intends to use what he or she has done just as an Apple owner/user uses his or her Apple - for everything from Internet browsing to downloading to gaming to distributed computing, etc.....

 

Cost is a factor, but the real costs are in time and effort. I think that we are all here because we have been disillusioned with Windows, and are either curious about Mac OS X and Macs in general, or because we know someone whose Mac introduced us to the wonders of OS X, and wondered how to have that experience for our very own. I know that even the much-vaunted Linux distros have their flaws (I am running Ubuntu 8.10 on my Dell Precision 450, and I can't even play a DVD let alone rip one, because it says that I need to install some library that I can't even find!). Mac OS X flavors are not perfect either, but they are much more stable than any Windows OS that I am aware of, with the possible exception of Windows Server 2003. Note that I am comparing client Mac OS X flavors to a SERVER Windows OS!

 

I am basically middle-of-the-road on whether to install and run a hacked version of OS X on a Hackintosh, or just to buy the Mac with the corresponding OS and software. Both have merit, but the Hackintosh owner runs the constant risk of updating their oh-so-carefully-balanced Hackintosh into a useless brick. To those of you who decide on the former route, rather than the latter, good luck to you.

[microsnakey]

Because I can.

I can run osx Leopard/XP/UBUNTU on my acer aspire one that cost me £150.

I prefer xp to osx but I will run it because its fun.

 

And the bragging rights

[MithrilFox]

The total cost of my setup, if it were a genuine Mac Pro rig, would be $5799.

 

Total cost of my Hackintosh rig of nearly equal hardware? $850.

 

I also own an iMac, Macbook, and iBook G4. I used to own two of those iBooks but sold one.

[hnzw_rui]

The total cost of my setup, if it were a genuine Mac Pro rig, would be $5799.

 

Total cost of my Hackintosh rig of nearly equal hardware? $850.

I somehow doubt that. While it's true that you will save quite a bit if you build your own equivalent system, I don't think the difference will be as bad as that (at least not if you don't tack on their ridiculously expensive upgrades). The Mac Pro uses server/workstation-class components and those tend to be expensive. The base $2,799 Mac Pro has two 2.8GHz Quad-Core Xeons. The price of the processors alone is $1,440 (Newegg, $720ea). The least expensive Intel 5400-chipset based board I've seen is $380 (Supermicro X7DWE). Not sure if Apple uses the Intel 5400 chipset but I seem to recall reading an article that says they do. FB-DIMMs are also more expensive than regular DDR2 or DDR3 RAM, albeit not at the ridiculous prices Apple's charging for them. Seriously, $9,100 for 32GB?! Crucial 8GB (2x4GB) DDR2 800 kits are just $360 and similar Kingston kits only cost $270. RAM and hard drives are easy to upgrade anyway. Buying the base system and upgrading RAM and hard drive yourself should net significant cost savings.

 

Not everyone will find a use for eight cores, though. I'm not really sure there are even that many apps that make use of four. Apple really should release a mid-level Mac without a built-in display. That seems to be the primary reason a lot of people build Hackintoshes. The other major reason seems to be just the challenge of doing something they shouldn't be able to, and that Apple couldn't really do anything against. Sure they can make it harder to install their OS on non-Apple-branded systems and their lawyers could sue and take down sites like this one but all that'll accomplish is alienate the community.

[MithrilFox]

You're absolutely right that it's not precisely equivalent (the Mac Pro has much better hardware).

 

However, the principle still stands that to get what I have now on a Mac Pro does indeed cost $5799, despite the fact that the processor is much nicer and so is the motherboard and RAM.

 

But, to get a Mac Pro with a 3.0GHz processor, 8GB RAM, 1.5TB HDD space (two drives), and an 8800GT, the cost is $5799.

 

Theoretically it would be cheaper if it weren't the way it is, but it is the way it is and that's how much it'd cost to order it from Apple. I actually went through and selected the options closest to what I have, and the Apple store gave me that number.

 

And yes, Apple definitely needs to release a mid-level Mac tower model. The biggest hole in the whole Mac line-up seems to be the lack of one of those. iMacs are great but a little pricey and lack upgradeability except for the RAM. Mac minis are great for low-end users who just need a nice computer to browse the internet with and type up documents, but they have virtually 0 upgradeability and don't fit everyone's needs.

 

I think Apple can become a more diverse company if Jobs would let go of some of his preconceptions about the market. As wonderful as his business strategies can be, he's flopped a lot... and majorly. He claims that he doesn't make computers for "people who fly economy class," but that's really the majority of the market out there.