Jump to content

How does one know if a site is a commercial spin-off of OSx86? (Specific Site in Mind!)


  • Please log in to reply
4 replies to this topic

#1
iWin32

iWin32

    InsanelyMac Geek

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 113 posts
  • Gender:Male

Before I go into my question, I first wish to say, as I have said in the first-gen Intel HD Graphics thread, I now have real Macs and am not nearly as active in the Hackintosh scene.  That being said, I still have an interest in it, and I still browse this forum from time to time.

 

However, something interesting caught my eye in this thread: http://www.insanelym...or-my-hackbook/

 

In it, the OP is asking for a location for a distro ISO of a specific version of OS X/macOS.  While posting direct or indirect links to pirated goods (distros included) are obviously not allowed in the rules, it was my understanding that the discussion of distros is allowed here for a number of reasons -- The main one being that distros were a part of our history.  That being said, the second post doesn't cite the rule of illegal download links, but instead, cites the rules about commercial spin-offs, like TonyMacx86.  This is interesting to me for a number of reasons.

 

First, the only distro maker to my knowledge that would now be considered a commercial spin-off is iATKOS, given that any new version now is only available after a donation.   But to my knowledge, that doesn't make all distros inherently a commercial spin-off.  In fact, the one being referenced in the OP is Hackintosh Zone, formerly known as Niresh.  His stuff has always been available for free, and to my knowledge, his past distros have been tolerated for discussion before.  Yet, somehow it became known as a commercial spin-off?

 

The only reason that might be justifiable in calling it that is because his site has ads.  But if that's the case, so does InsanelyMac, and surely you don't consider yourself a commercial spin-off, right?  Besides, who in their right mind would host this stuff for free, use their own money for bandwidth and server costs, and make zero profit?  That doesn't make much sense.  (I know I'm playing devil's advocate here, but it just seems absurd that ads would be a reason to call something a commercial spin-off.  TonyMac has ads, but that's not one of the reasons we don't support him here!  And we also support open source developers who have donation buttons, yet we don't consider them commercial.)  I guess I'm struggling to see why InsanelyMac would consider Hackintosh Zone/Niresh a commercial spin-off.

 

Also, for that matter, what about those like iATKOS, where they once produced free distros but became a commercial spinoff?  As old as their free distros are now, does that mean we no longer support them altogether?  Or, is discussion and support of the free distros still allowed, with the paid ones restricted accordingly?

 

And if anyone is wondering why I just didn't PM the guy or reply in that thread, I feel like this is a question that is not entirely related to the OP, and that it warrants it's own discussion, especially for newbies who don't understand what makes a site a commercial spin-off.  We have a locked thread specifically about Tony, and I'm sure no one would disagree that Psystar in its day was considered a commercial spin-off.  But even what goes into a moderator's or admin's decision as to what to and what not to consider a commercial spin-off would be helpful, especially considering there isn't a term used a lot in the Hackintosh world or the Internet in general.  Just about everyone (newbies included) knows what P2P means, but commercial spin-off?  Does that mean we can talk about The Suite Life of Zack and Cody, but not The Suite Life on Deck?   :P (Sorry, that was the best joke I could come up with!!)

 

I just want to be clear on what these examples are according to the forum rules, and if it's at all possible, where does one draw the line from sites we can discuss and support and sites that are commercial spin-offs?



#2
mfc88

mfc88

    Retired

  • Donators
  • 605 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Jose, Calif.

From my understanding, Hackintosh Zone forces you to view their website with your ad-blocker turned off, a pay-to-play tactic, while InsanelyMac doesn't. Also, the legality of using/creating/distributing a modified version of an operating system may raise a red flag. Their modified OS is essentially a pirated piece of software. They are taking someone else's work, modifying it, then slapping their name on it, "Niresh Mavericks," "Yosemite Zone,"...etc. Essentially, they're making (advert/donation) money off the creation/distribution/supporting of pirated software. InsanelyMac makes (advert/donation) money with the discussion of Apple products... yet so do the COUNTLESS of other game-related, software-related, hardware-related forums (but again, they're not distributing pirated... anything). In addition, Niresh's distribution of their distro is through dubious methods (P2P), which happens to be against InsanelyMac's rules:
 

No posting of direct or indirect links to warez or pirated pieces of software, this includes cracks, serials and torrents.
Discussion of P2P, torrent sites, or similar download sites of any kind will not be tolerated. We do not want to know your illegal downloading habits.

 
Which, one could argue, would also violate this rule:
 

No posting of copyrighted material. This includes copying and pasting news articles from news websites.

 
As far as I know, their distros aren't open source (nearly everything you find on this website, you can find the source to, and it doesn't require jumping through adverts to do so). Niresh could essentially put whatever they wanted inside of their distros (malware) and the average user would have no idea (not stating that they do, but they could).

 

And as kosakgroove mentioned, why use/support an old modified version of an OS that most likely won't work with your setup anyway?



#3
0000-1248

0000-1248

    InsanelyMac Shekelmeister

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 288 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Brisbane, Australia
  • Interests:OSx86 Project, Computer Hardware, Physics, Paleontology, Pink Floyd

A good reply, however I see some points that need clarification.

From my understanding, Hackintosh Zone forces you to view their website with your ad-blocker turned off, a pay-to-play tactic.
 

Many websites do this, such as the news report website Forbes. This doesn't mean that they are forcing you to 'pay to play'. You still get to use the services for free! There isn't a 'Donate to Continue' button. And in any case this can be averted by inspect element so it isn't a problem.

 

 

 In addition, Niresh's distribution of their distro is through dubious methods (P2P), which happens to be against InsanelyMac's rules:

I'm sick of people saying this. Peer to peer sharing IS NOT a 'dubious method' just because it is used for piracy. It was not created for nor has ever been intended by the creators for illegal use. Are CDs a 'dubious' sharing method just because you can burn pirated music onto them? Peer to peer is most effective for large file sharing, and in fact with Windows 10 update downloading Microsoft has been using peer to peer sharing for their update distribution. Does this mean that Microsoft are an illegal company? In my opinion the InsanelyMac rules should change so that it is only illegal use of P2P that is banned; P2P is used for a lot of other things, it isn't all bad.

 

Other than that I agree with most everything you said.

 

Best regards,

 

- Matt



#4
mfc88

mfc88

    Retired

  • Donators
  • 605 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Jose, Calif.

Peer to peer is most effective for large file sharing, and in fact with Windows 10 update downloading Microsoft has been using peer to peer sharing for their update distribution.

Wasn't there a huge backlash for this very thing? And how irresponsible it was for them to take up user's bandwidth to seed their updates? It's escaping my mind, but at the time, I could have sworn this caused quite a bit of commotion...

 

Microsoft isn't the best example when it comes to their update distribution...

https://www.extremet...dows-10-upgrade
 

P2P is used for a lot of other things, it isn't all bad.

Other than Microsoft, what other company/website uses P2P for distribution. Not a whole lot. Maybe some lesser known artists who want to share their music or some creators who want to share some Linux distros via P2P, but in practical terms, you'll want something that is reliable, dedicated and consistent for EVERY user, and not slow for some and fast for others that will be based on some random user's upload cap (here in the States, it's painfully awful -- an ISP will offer you an overpriced 250MBit download with a 4mbit upload).

 

But aside from that the P2P distribution, the big thing to focus on is that: Niresh OS's are pretty old (El Capitan was released back in September 2015) and that they blatantly rip off its source material. Renaming someone's else's work to include your name is a bit... wrong.



#5
0000-1248

0000-1248

    InsanelyMac Shekelmeister

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 288 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Brisbane, Australia
  • Interests:OSx86 Project, Computer Hardware, Physics, Paleontology, Pink Floyd

Wasn't there a huge backlash for this very thing? And how irresponsible it was for them to take up user's bandwidth to seed their updates? It's escaping my mind, but at the time, I could have sworn this caused quite a bit of commotion...

 

Microsoft isn't the best example when it comes to their update distribution...

https://www.extremet...dows-10-upgrade

My point wasn't that it was a good thing that Microsoft used P2P without people knowing, but that it wasn't only used for illegal purposes. And to be fair, they did agree to that in the Windows 10 T&S. (Personally, I stay on Windows 7, but that's besides the point.)

 

 

Microsoft isn't the best example when it comes to their update distribution...

https://www.extremet...dows-10-upgrade
 

Other than Microsoft, what other company/website uses P2P for distribution. Not a whole lot.

Here is how businesses use P2P.

Very small Linux distributions such as.... Ubuntu?

Torrent downloads available for 'lesser' distros such as Ubuntu.

Gimp also has a Torrent download via BitTorrent.

Just to name a two extremely 'vague and uncommon' programs and software out of the many.







0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

© 2017 InsanelyMac  |   News  |   Forum  |   Downloads  |   OSx86 Wiki  |   Designed by Ed Gain  |   Logo by irfan  |   Privacy Policy