60Hz 4K on Mavericks with GTX 760? [UPDATE: 10.9.3 works [UPDATED UPDATE: maybe]]

[Ricky Romero]

Kind of a continuation of my previous thread, but I thought I'd share my progress.

 

I got the EVGA GTX 760 FTW 4GB, which works great when setting GraphicsEnabler=No.  I also got the Dell UP2414Q – gorgeous monitor, by the way – and I now have native 4K output.  But only at 30Hz.  Which feels really laggy.

 

Windows can run the display at 60Hz at native 3840x2160 over DisplayPort 1.2, but OS X can't.  I've got a feeling it's a driver problem.

 

I'm probably the only one on this forum with this issue, but is there any way to force OS X to refresh this display at 60Hz when running at 4K?  Or do I just have to wait for new drivers from Apple?

 

EDIT: See my update about 10.9.3.

EDITED EDIT: See my update about the final version of 10.9.3.

FINAL EDIT: See my update after extensive testing. (My setup doesn't work, but there are other 4K monitors which do for other people.)

[Rampage Dev]

Not a issue as this is Apples spec. Apples standard and Windows standard are different. 

 

That said if your monitor is of 4K spec you can over-ride Apples standard and Windows for that matter by forcing 60 Hz by the monitor settings. 

[Ricky Romero]

That said if your monitor is of 4K spec you can over-ride Apples standard and Windows for that matter by forcing 60 Hz by the monitor settings.

 

Thanks for the response.

 

Which monitor settings are you talking about?  The fastest refresh rate in Apple's control panel is 30.3Hz (but this causes a blank screen).

 

 

Lower resolutions allow for faster refresh rates...

 

 

...but I want to run 3840x2160@60Hz like in Windows.  Is there a hack I can use to force it?

[boli]

Current UHD displays apparently consist of two half-panels that need to be driven separately (MST mode over displayport) to run at 60 Hz, and the OS needs to "combine" the two half-panels into a full one. So yes, it's a driver issue. 
 
The new Mac Pro can do it with Sharp/ASUS UHD displays but not the Dell.
 
Maybe other Macs and Hacks will be able to do it too come 10.9.2 or a later update.
 
Update: Apparently it does, according to 4K @ 60 Hz comes to OSX in 10.9.2 Beta @Netkas.

[instantbrigade]

Ricky, if you're still around, could you answer a quick question? I'm really close to pulling the trigger on a Dell UP2414q.

 

Can you get 60hz while running in 1920 x 1080p (HiDPI) or is it only available when running 1080p?

[rominator]

 

Update: Apparently it does, according to 4K @ 60 Hz comes to OSX in 10.9.2 Beta @Netkas.

 

 

The guy who posted that is an idiot. 

 

Anyhow, the thread actually states that AMD 79xx cards can do 60Hz in 10.9.2 Betas, the Nvidia cards get the "wha wha"

 

I have tested up through 12c39 but haven't tried 44 yet, but not too excited that it will work.

 

I imagine that they are in no hurry, it is essentially adding what has been a Windows only feature to OSX drivers. Is there a TB2 Mac with Nvidia card that runs 4K?

 

In any case, "ill try 44 sooner or later but I wouldn't expect it.

[juliantoledo]

I am very interested in buying the Dell up2414q for my Hackintosh (with a GTX 760), please let us know if any of you manage to get 60Hz over DP1.2.

 

Thanks!

[Ricky Romero]

Just thought I'd post a quick update: I just installed the 10.9.2 release (13C64) and I'm still missing MST drivers.  Capped at 30Hz for now.

 

Here's hoping 10.9.3 will deliver, because this monitor is amazing otherwise.

 

[Ricky Romero]

I imagine that they are in no hurry, it is essentially adding what has been a Windows only feature to OSX drivers. Is there a TB2 Mac with Nvidia card that runs 4K?

 

The high-end 15" 2013 Retina MacBook Pro ships with the NVIDIA GeForce GT 750M, and it has Thunderbolt 2 (and therefore DisplayPort 1.2).  So it meets the requirements.

 

There's a big thread about this on Apple's discussion forums, and these MacBook Pro owners don't have MST support in their drivers either.  However, since NVIDIA provides drivers for Windows directly, they (and I) report success running 4K at 60Hz with MST in Windows.

 

The question is whether Apple will update the drivers with MST support for these systems, or leave them in the cold and wait for the next hardware revision (which I would predict is just as likely).

 

In either case, for Hackintosh users, it's gonna happen.  Just a question of when.

[rominator]

AMD drivers got MST in 10.9.2, Nvidia likely soon.

[bkilla188]

Looks like we might be getting 60hz in 10.9.3 . Dev distro out now!

 

http://www.macrumors.com/2014/03/07/os-x-10-9-3-retina-option-4k-displays/

Full MST support!

 

OS X 10.9.3 brings official option for upscale resolution and full MST support. pic.twitter.com/GjKYJZBYZi

[Ricky Romero]

Looks like we might be getting 60hz in 10.9.3 . Dev distro out now!

 

http://www.macrumors.com/2014/03/07/os-x-10-9-3-retina-option-4k-displays/

Full MST support!

 

I can confirm this with 10.9.3 beta 1 on my system (though, in my case, the upscale resolution is just a list of pixel dimensions).

 

Not sure if the drivers still need some optimization though – while I can see that it's refreshing the display at 60Hz, it looks like my card might not be able to render at that framerate in OS X right now. Running it at native resolution, @2x scaling.  For example, the highest framerate I can get on acko.net (a WebGL site) on that monitor is 36 FPS.

 

That said, there could be some optimizations on their way still.  Windows handles 4K pretty well on this machine.

[le jean]

I can confirm this with 10.9.3 beta 1 on my system (though, in my case, the upscale resolution is just a list of pixel dimensions).

 

Not sure if the drivers still need some optimization though – while I can see that it's refreshing the display at 60Hz, it looks like my card might not be able to render at that framerate in OS X right now. Running it at native resolution, @2x scaling.  For example, the highest framerate I can get on acko.net (a WebGL site) on that monitor is 36 FPS.

 

That said, there could be some optimizations on their way still.  Windows handles 4K pretty well on this machine.

Hey Ricky! Thanks for the feedback, that is some great news!

 

I also have the Dell UP 2414Q Display attached to an nVidia GTX 660 Graphics Card via Displayport.

Unfortunatley I am still stuck at 30Hz running 10.9.3. Beta 1

 

Is there any changes you made to your setup (Software/Display OSD)?

 

How is rendering in Finder, scrolling in Safari when running 60Hz? Did you get rid of that lagginess?

 

[Ricky Romero]

Hey Ricky! Thanks for the feedback, that is some great news!

 

I also have the Dell UP 2414Q Display attached to an nVidia GTX 660 Graphics Card via Displayport.

Unfortunatley I am still stuck at 30Hz running 10.9.3. Beta 1

 

Is there any changes you made to your setup (Software/Display OSD)?

 

I had to go into the monitor's settings and choose Menu > Display Settings > DisplayPort 1.2.  It's not enabled by default.

 

Other than that, just make sure that you have a DisplayPort 1.2 cable and a DP 1.2 port available on your GTX.

 

Also note that OS X supports my card without any hacks – YMMV.

 

How is rendering in Finder, scrolling in Safari when running 60Hz? Did you get rid of that lagginess?

 

I haven't tried yet – I only booted into 10.9.3 briefly.  I might give it another go today.

 

The framerate problems were pretty much systemwide though, and they didn't occur on my 2560x1440 display.  Even moving the cursor and dragging windows around on my 4K display was not smooth like on my other display.  I definitely know that it's refreshing at 60Hz though.

[le jean]

I had to go into the monitor's settings and choose Menu > Display Settings > DisplayPort 1.2.  It's not enabled by default.

 

Other than that, just make sure that you have a DisplayPort 1.2 cable and a DP 1.2 port available on your GTX.

 

Thanks for directions Ricky. Unfortunately I can not report any success with my GTX 660. UP2414Q & GTX660 (connected via Displayport 1.2) is still stuck to 30Hz SST Mode in 10.9.3 Beta 1.

I might try replacing my graphics card with a GTX 760 oder Radeon HD 7950. At least the Dell display seems to be white listed for MST support since the latest seed of 10.9.3 Beta, backed by your reports.

[Tino2]

Had a similar Issue, switch Res x solves it in the free version.... You can force manually the 50 / 60 Hz mode. (for 1080p and not 4k)  

[Ricky Romero]

Just installed 10.9.3 beta 2 and it's even better.  Not only am I seeing 60Hz refresh rate with MST, but the pixels coming off of the card are keeping up with it now.  Getting nice smooth window dragging and cursor movement, and it's just as smooth as on my non-4K display!

 

This is excellent! 

[le jean]

Just installed 10.9.3 beta 2 and it's even better.  Not only am I seeing 60Hz refresh rate with MST, but the pixels coming off of the card are keeping up with it now.  Getting nice smooth window dragging and cursor movement, and it's just as smooth as on my non-4K display!

 

This is excellent! 

 

Thanks Ricky! This is amazing news!

 

Just wanted to let people know that Radeon 7950 and GTX 660 cards are still not enabled for 60Hz operation in 10.9.3 Beta 2.

 

I might try changing my graphics card into a GTX 760 on Hackintosh as I don't see any progress concerning Radeon drivers nor support for GTX 660

 

Update - 2014/03/16

 

I have been testing different setups in the last couple of days. Unfortunately I could not get 60Hz to work on the Dell UP2414Q 4K Display.

 

My system is:

 

Dell UP 2414Q, Display Port 1.2 (MST) enabled in OSD

 

GA-Z87MX-D3H (F6 Bios)

Intel 4670K

Corsair 16GB 1600MHz

Crucial m4 SSD

 

I checked for available resolutions using Display Menu

 

OS X 10.9.3 Beta Build 13D12

Gigabyte - GTX 660

3.840 × 2.160 @ 30Hz , Retina Scaling available, Sometimes Black Screens during POST and after chameleon boot

EVGA GTX 760

3.840 × 2.160 @ 30Hz, Retina Scaling available, Sometimes Black Screens during POST and after chameleon boot

XFX Radeon 7950

3.840 × 2.160 @ 30Hz, Retina Scaling available

 

OS X 10.9.3 Beta Build 13D17

Gigabyte - GTX 660

Won't load UI

EVGA GTX 760

Won't load UI

XFX Radeon 7950

3.840 × 2.160 @ 30Hz, Retina Scaling available

 

Problems with 13D17 seem to be related to changes in Apples integrated drivers and power handling for PCIe. There is a discussion about it going on over here at netkas forum

 

While I am having nothing but trouble with that 4K display, Ricky seems to be fine running his Dell 2414Q with that exact same GTX 760 Graphics card on an X79 Platform main board (Asus P9X79 WS)

[boli]

I tested a Dell UP 2414Q on a late 2012 iMac with GTX 675MX, as well as a late 13" rMBP with Haswell processer graphics, using both 10.9.2 and 10.9.3 beta:

• 3840x2160 and 1920x1080 HiDPI work at 30 Hz in 10.9.2 on both machines
• The above plus 3 other HiDPI resolutions work at 30 Hz in 10.9.3 beta on both machines (2560x1440 HiDPI, 3200x1800 HiDPI, don't remember the smallest one)
• HiDPI worked in landscape mode only, but not portrait mode. In portrait the regular non-HiDPI res was used and as such was blurry
• No 60 Hz at full resolution with either machine (yes the display is set to DP 1.2/MST)
• Might try late 2013 15" rMBP
• Will definitely try Hackintosh with GTX 780 as well as Mac Pro with Radeon 5870 at some point in the future
• For more detail see Re: 4K @ 60 Hz comes to OSX in 10.9.2 Beta

The guy who posted that is an idiot.

 
No need to be rude because I posted the slightly (un)related but IMO still interesting link to your thread.

[boli]

Might try late 2013 15" rMBP

 

Tried it, and it was able to drive the display at 60 Hz in all resolutions I tested: 1920x1080 HiDPI, 2560x1440 HiDPI and 3860x2160. Moving the mouse cursor and windows was smooth (unlike 30 Hz). I didn't have time to try anything else, but given the immense amount of pixels it needs to move around I wouldn't be surprised if some things were a bit slower than normal.

[boli]

Tried various things to get 10.9.3 beta to boot on my Hack, to no avail. So unfortunately can't test the UP2414Q with it yet. There are a few others with similar problems too, details are in this Netkas thread.

 

@Ricky Romero:

Is there anything particular you had to do to get 10.9.3 beta running with your GTX 760?

 

So far I'm unsuccessful with GTX 770 and 780, I get constant WindowServer crashes instead of the login screen. I didn't have those problems with 10.9.1 or 10.9.2 (though 10.9.2 seems more unstable than 10.9.1 for me).

[Ricky Romero]

This is the exact card I'm using on my hack.  I don't have any graphics enablers or hacks needed to make my card work.

 

It's also important to make sure that:

1. When booting into Windows, the latest drivers for your card will run your 4K display at 60Hz.
2. Your monitor is set up to receive a DisplayPort 1.2 signal.
3. You are using a DisplayPort 1.2 cable.  This is the one I use.

I don't know if my motherboard has anything to do with 4K MST output, but it's certainly possible.

 

I tested a Dell UP 2414Q on a late 2012 iMac with GTX 675MX, as well as a late 13" rMBP with Haswell processer graphics, using both 10.9.2 and 10.9.3 beta:

 

Not sure about the 13".  It has Thunderbolt 2 (and therefore DisplayPort 1.2), but I don't know if the Iris graphics will drive 4K at 60Hz. You might want to try it in Windows.

 

Your iMac, though, can't run 4K at 60Hz as it doesn't have TB2.

[boli]

Thanks for your reply.

 

Enabling MST/DP1.2 is not my problem, but booting 10.9.3 beta on my Hack is.

 

I did already run the display at 60 Hz in full (and HiDPI) resolutions with a 15" rMBP 2013 using 10.9.3 beta, as well as my Hackintosh using Windows 8 (see pic).

A 13" rMBP 2013 I tried couldn't do it however. And yes, the late 2012 iMac (my work machine) can't run it at 60 Hz either, that's the first thing I confirmed.

 

I don't know if my motherboard has anything to do with 4K MST output, but it's certainly possible.

 

Yeah maybe. Out of interest, did you have the NVidia web drivers installed before updating to 10.9.3 beta? What bootloader do you use?

 

I'm pretty much out of ideas. The (clone of the) 10.9.2 install I upgraded to 10.9.3 booted just fine before the update, and I'm writing this from another 10.9.2 install without booting problems.

[MTWomg]

I can boot 10.9.3 (all the builds including the new beta that just came out) just fine on a hack, but getting retina working at 60hz is a thing. I don't need to replace any files to get the system up, but I can only set 30hz resolutions.

Works fine on my late 2013 MBPR. Would be nice to get this fixed. Using Clover as my bootloader. Graphics card is the GTX 670. 60hz works in Windows just fine.

[Ricky Romero]

 

Yeah maybe. Out of interest, did you have the NVidia web drivers installed before updating to 10.9.3 beta? What bootloader do you use?

 

I'm pretty much out of ideas. The (clone of the) 10.9.2 install I upgraded to 10.9.3 booted just fine before the update, and I'm writing this from another 10.9.2 install without booting problems.

 

I did try the NVIDIA web drivers when I was trying to get 60Hz working initially, but I'm 95% sure I wiped all traces of them from my system.

 

I'm using Chameleon v2.2svn r2377 right now.  Maybe you'll find my plist configs useful.

 

One problem I ran into with beta 2 was that my card would only drive my 4K monitor, and not my 27" DVI display.  Gonna test on beta 3 to see if I run into the same problems as you guys.

 

UPDATE: Tried 10.9.3 beta 3 and I'm having no luck getting my second monitor working, though the 4K display is still working fine.  Also tried deleting /Library/Preferences/com.apple.windowserver.plist to no avail.

UPDATE 2: Just tried deleting all the DisplayVendorID entries in /System/Library/Displays/Overrides, also to no avail.  I'm stumped.  Back to 10.9.2 for now.