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#1
ameris_cyning

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Hey guys!

I remember when I first came to this forum. It was the end of 07. At times there were SOOO many people that there would be timeout errors. At any given time we would have thousands upon thousands of guests and several hundred active members.

What happened?

How did activity sink this low?

How can we remedy this situation?

Inactivity destroys online communities. Now, I love the OSx86 scene. I have loved it for many years. I find great enjoyment at getting this {censored} to work on a regular PC. It is fun. From other websites out there (that shant be named for obvious reasons) there are active members on those. Although it isn't as active at its peak in '09, it is still pretty active.

Thoughts/Complaints/shut up q64ceo?

#2
xmaniak100

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Maan its the problem that since lion stuff got so complicated and people just quit... you know back then it was just so much easier... people had no problems installing os x and then asked for making it fully work, but now its like you hardly even install it and there is no active person whos going to help you... its just that things are getting a lot harder and only people who are as obsessed with hackintosh like me will endure...

#3
Gringo Vermelho

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That's a new one.

It has never been easier to install OS X on a PC than it is now.

#4
xmaniak100

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I dont think so... Maybe for you with intel because tony came... but for me and many others on amd its not THAT easy... And not everyone got i3,5 or 7...

I remember when I was installing 10.5.6 iDeneb I had no problems, even x86_64 worked on amd... I had a little more problems on SL, I heavily tested amd kernel on lion... that was a hard one. And with ml here...I think things are getting a little too hard for some amd users out there(and there are more of them because intel cpus seem overpriced to me)

#5
theconnactic

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Hi, Xmaniak100!

We're on the verge of getting things easier for AMD again, thanks to the Mountain Lion AMD kernel research, which brought, among other things, full 64-bit support, ssse3 emulation (in fact, universal opcode emulation) and the new CPUID patcher.

The problem for us AMD users is that, since AMD has been sucking big time these days (finally they seem to have got it right with Piledriver, but it's one success among lots of failures), many good AMD developers simply migrated to Intel: it got to a point where the premium price tag worth avoiding the sum of bad performance and unreliability (and, if you take the progress of Intel with power consumption, where AMD is really far behind, you'll see Intel CPUs pay themselves the price difference in less than a year in the power bill).

So we had to wait for someone to take the task of developing for AMD for the sheer intelectual challenge, and then came Sinetek and (again) Andy Vandjick, and their success brought others back to AMD development, like Bronzovka and R:A:W:X86, so we got lucky. Now we can install Snow Leopard and Lion almost seamlessly with full 64-bit support. Even Mountain Lion, by the way, as long as you have an ATI card.

That said, i don't really think there's inactivity going on here. That's kind of ciclic, as i see it.

Best regards.

#6
Gringo Vermelho

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It has never been easier to install OS X on a PC than it is now.

I dont think so... Maybe for you with intel because tony came...


Uh no, try again? You have no idea.... it has nothing to do with Tony.

Tony is like FedEx, he delivers packages to your doorstep. Everything inside was made by other people.

#7
WhatTheTech

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As others have mentioned, I'm not sure it has anything to do with ease. If you look at Google's data for trends on the word "hackintosh", it peaked during '09-'10 and then declined over the next two years:

Posted Image

I think what we're seeing is just the (not unexpected) nature of technology, with forum interest reflecting the interest in hackintoshes in general. I would venture a guess that many people initially came to IM for guidance on building a hackintosh, I know that's why I came here after visiting osx86 project wiki and finding links to full guides pointing to the forums. Coupled with the fact that hackintosh-building information is simply more accessible (Youtube, lifehacker, individual blogs etc.), I think that the forum is evolving in its main function - rather than immediately coming here directly for help, people will search around a little bit, gather info from multiple sites, and then come back to a forum like this with specific problems or simply for general discussion.

Obviously, I'm not contesting the fact that forum attendance both from users and guests has declined, but I'm not sure that there is anything that can be done to combat socio-technological trends. Offer good information in a concise way and people will read it. One thing that Tonymac can be commended for is his understanding of this phenomenon. By providing recommended builds and official guides (whatever his motivations) he has elevated the easiest-to-follow information out of forum status, and into the reach of casual readers. My first build was using the tools provided by his site, and the only reason I visited his forums was to download the tools, only accessible from that location with registration. Of course, this was a gateway to being (formerly) very active there, but the initial point of contact was an article on their blog.

Just my $0.02...

#8
Alessandro17

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One thing that Tonymac can be commended for is his understanding of this phenomenon. By providing recommended builds and official guides (whatever his motivations) he has elevated the easiest-to-follow information out of forum status, and into the reach of casual readers.


Tonycrap doesn't always work, far from it. When it doesn't, nobody helps the hapless noobs who fall in the tonysh... trap. They don't get help there, they don't get help here, because we have forbidden it. They can't help themselves because they know absolutely nothing about hackintoshing.
As my fellow members of staff have already said, it has never been easier to install OS X on a PC than it is now. If installing OS X by following our simple guides is still too difficult for you, then use a distribution, I find it preferable to filling the pockets of a buffoon like tonymac. Distributions nowadays are point and click.
However nobody ever said that installing OS X on a PC was a God granted right, nor that it should be used to get a cheap Mac. If you lack basic computer skills, you should use Windows or Linux instead.
Installing OS X on AMD has "always" been made possible by the community of OSx86 developers, not by tonythief, who forbids discussing it in his forum.
Personally I find that people who want to install OS X on an AMD based PC are asking too much: real Macs use Intel.

#9
WhatTheTech

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Alessandro, perhaps I did not fully explain my position. My comment was related specifically to the information on his site, not hackintosh information in general that is available from all sources. He has elevated the easiest-to-follow information from his forums to guides on his site. I'm not saying it's the best information available anywhere, nor would I recommend directly that anyone follow it, but looking at his website as a microcosm, an entity unto itself, this is what he has done, and it has been effective for him within his website.

We can argue all day long about who has the best information and who presents it in the best way, as well as who is a toolbox and who isn't, but providing easy access to information is a principle that is not bound by any persona behind said information, but is directly tied to our psychological desire for getting the most knowledge from the least amount of effort. Whether people should be lazy or not is another question, but if we're tying this all in to the original point, I think the access to quick guides on various websites is a contributing factor to the decline in the numbers of people rummaging around the forums.

#10
Alessandro17

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WhatTheTech, never mind. I quoted your post because it was a good introduction to what I wanted to say, but my post wasn't meant as a reply to you.

#11
WhatTheTech

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WhatTheTech, never mind. I quoted your post because it was a good introduction to what I wanted to say, but my post wasn't meant as a reply to you.


Ah, that explains it :D

#12
theconnactic

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If you lack basic computer skills, you should use Windows or Linux instead.


In fact, installing OSX on compatible hardware is far easier than installing any Linux distro: i could tell you from my own experience.

Personally I find that people who want to install OS X on an AMD based PC are asking too much: real Macs use Intel.


I beg to differ: in fact, if the main goal of the community is the knowledge and fun gained by installing OSX on unsupported hardware, the challenge of getting AMD to work suits it perfectly. In my personal observation, people who assemble vanilla-compatible parts are precisely the ones who want a less expensive alternative to a Mac, because "oh, Apple products are soooo overpriced"... you don't need to believe me: just check Voldemort's and go figure.

Exception made for these two little points, i subscribe your comment verbatim.

#13
Rampage Dev

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That's a new one.

It has never been easier to install OS X on a PC than it is now.


Installing Mac OS X now takes the same amount of time as Windows. I can take a pile of parts and in 2 hours have a fully working hack and a fully edited DSDT. When Lion came out I was so pleased on how easy it became.

#14
ameris_cyning

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Tonycrap doesn't always work, far from it. When it doesn't, nobody helps the hapless noobs who fall in the tonysh... trap. They don't get help there, they don't get help here, because we have forbidden it. They can't help themselves because they know absolutely nothing about hackintoshing.
As my fellow members of staff have already said, it has never been easier to install OS X on a PC than it is now. If installing OS X by following our simple guides is still too difficult for you, then use a distribution, I find it preferable to filling the pockets of a buffoon like tonymac. Distributions nowadays are point and click.
However nobody ever said that installing OS X on a PC was a God granted right, nor that it should be used to get a cheap Mac. If you lack basic computer skills, you should use Windows or Linux instead.
Installing OS X on AMD has "always" been made possible by the community of OSx86 developers, not by tonythief, who forbids discussing it in his forum.
Personally I find that people who want to install OS X on an AMD based PC are asking too much: real Macs use Intel.


There is nothing more frustrating and fun then getting an AMD machine working.

When you get it to work you get such a headrush considering how difficult it is.

AMD hackintoshing is straight up fun

#15
theconnactic

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Can you guys imagine how big is the user base of OSX86 (which is different from OSX)? I bet it's bigger than that of some Linux distros.

#16
ameris_cyning

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Can you guys imagine how big is the user base of OSX86 (which is different from OSX)? I bet it's bigger than that of some Linux distros.


Most def. Not as big as, lets say, Ubuntu; but still rather large.

If we could only get these people to be interactive our community will thrive again.

#17
eep357

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Thank You Tony, I couldn't have broke it with out you! Lol, I know someone who, with updates, has been installing Windows for a few days now :) Anyway, it's so easy, people don't need to spend days on here or elsewhere figuring out how to make basic stuff work. People used to be happy with mostly working OSX, now they cry if USB3 or bluetooth doesn't work, "I refuse to put a super small almost un-noticable bluetooth dongle in my Hackintosh, that's unacceptable!" And stuff like that, no joke, they really do.

#18
SS01

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...
People used to be happy with mostly working OSX, now they cry if USB3 or bluetooth doesn't work
...

I think this is exactly it. In Tiger/Leopard days, OSx86 was still recognized as a "Hacker" project, and people were happy just to get OS X booting on their PCs. These days, installation is so easy (not saying that's a bad thing), that people assume everything will just work, and if it doesn't, they go back to windows. It's kind of sad.

Also possibly playing a factor is that in Tiger/Leopard days, Apple had, for the most part, the latest technology, so the PCs that OSx86 was installed on were quite similar to Apple hardware. These days some of Apple's rigs (I'm looking at you, Mac Pro) are so outdated, that people build PCs with never hardware, and expect it to work in OS X.

/lament

#19
Rampage Dev

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These days some of Apple's rigs (I'm looking at you, Mac Pro) are so outdated, that people build PCs with never hardware, and expect it to work in OS X.


And what new hardware are you referring to? I know of no new Intel Socket that does not work under Mac OS X. I am on LGA 2011 and the only thing that does not work for me is native power management so I am not understanding your statement.

People are just picky with things and the real issue is that they want a cheap mac and expect this to be a perfect solution even if they buy incompatible hardware.

#20
SS01

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And what new hardware are you referring to? I know of no new Intel Socket that does not work under Mac OS X. I am on LGA 2011 and the only thing that does not work for me is native power management so I am not understanding your statement.

People are just picky with things and the real issue is that they want a cheap mac and expect this to be a perfect solution even if they buy incompatible hardware.

It's not so much a matter of people wanting hardware that doesn't work with Mac OS X, it's people wanting hardware that doesn't work easily with Mac OS X. Then they just give up and go back to Windows or buy a Mac.

Your last sentence basically summarized my post.





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