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What is the point in having a quiz?


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#1
JamesLittler

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If users are able to post their questions in the 'New Users Lounge' , what is the point of having a quiz?!

I understand the need for the first part of the quiz, i.e. filtering out spambots etc; but the second part, to me, seems illogical and a detrement to the forum.

After passing the first quiz, users are restricted to which sub-forums they can post in until they pass the second part of the quiz.
The result is that the 'New Users Lounge' is becomming a mass of unrelated garbage; topics about Snow mixed in with Lion; all manner of hardware related questions. All of which would be better suited to their respective sub-forums.

The 'New Users Lounge' should provide a forum for the most basic questions; i.e. 'What is a kext'; 'What is a boot loader'; 'Where do I start' etc.
NOT
'iAtkos L2 boot problem help' - Should be in Lion installation/post-installation depending where the user is stuck.
'Atheros AR9285 WPA/WPA2 DHCP Trouble' - Should be in hardware/Lan & Wireless.

This forum is going to become impossible to moderate effectively if the current system is not revised.
Are mods really expected to go through the 'New Users Lounge' and catagorise every thread into their respective sub-forums? Which then leads to the OP not being able to contribute further, as the thread is moved to a forum where the OP has no permission to post.
OR will the 'New Users Lounge' be allowed to spiral in to further chaos?!

As I see it, the easiest course of action would be the following:
Either remove the 2nd quiz + all related restrictions, this would allow new users to post in the relevant sub-forum and will keep the forum tidy.
OR
Replace the 1st quiz with the 2nd quiz. I mean seriously, if you don't know how to install a kext, should you really be posting AT ALL, regardless of in which sub-forum?! You do not learn by posting, you learn by reading!
This will serve the purpose of both quiz's combined.

#2
EvilMacMongo

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I must agree, I am a new memeber and it seemed to be a PITA to get setup on here to ask for some help.....Not that anyone has helped yet.......But if it is being done to weed out the people who have no clue what they are doing then yes it is a good idea, but if it becomes such a pain that other people aren't willing to sign up, less help will be offered.

#3
Gringo Vermelho

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One thing that New Users Lounge is good for is restricting the amount of garbage that would otherwise end up on other forums. New Users Lounge is relatively new, the situation was a lot worse before it was created. Unfortunately it doesn't keep out stupid and lazy people, I don't think there's anything we can do about that. We can't force people to try to read and educate themselves before posting.

I believe the primary purpose of the quiz was to keep out spam bots.

#4
JamesLittler

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It's more part 2 I have a fundamental problem with.
If you're not a spam bot, why should you not be able to ask your question in the relevant section? Because you're new to the forum?! is that any justification. New != Stupid.

Have you ever tried to find a thread, looked everywhere, only to eventually come across it a week later in the depths of 'New Users Lounge', an uncatagorised mess of a sub-forum?

#5
ZØØT

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Ha!

It would have been so much simpler had they just asked; "Do you like dogs?"

#6
Alessandro17

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It's more part 2 I have a fundamental problem with.
If you're not a spam bot, why should you not be able to ask your question in the relevant section?


I believe Gringo Vermelho already answered that:

One thing that New Users Lounge is good for is restricting the amount of garbage that would otherwise end up on other forums.

We could change all this by removing quiz 1. So people would have to take a pretty tough quiz before writing anywhere.
I don't know what good that would be. More "advanced" users take both quizzes in one go, with great results. The remaining ones (and there are a few) couldn't write anywhere.We get quite frequently PMs "I couldn't pass quiz 2, could you help me please?"
These are difficult choices, it depends which kind of forum we want. I have no problem in making IM an elite forum, with one really tough quiz, much harder than quiz 2. But is it what we really want? Do we want to be open only to an elite?
Others have tried, and while they have now very few silly posts and topics, (but they still have something like our New User Lounge for those who can't pass their quiz), they have very few users active at any time.

#7
JamesLittler

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I have no problem in making IM an elite forum, with one really tough quiz, much harder than quiz 2. But is it what we really want? Do we want to be open only to an elite?

In order to install there are various things that you WILL need to know, 'how to install a kext' is a good example.
Is that elitist or pre-requisite knowledge?

I'm not saying shut out those that are willing to learn, maybe we should provide a knowledge base for new users where all basic info is readily available, this subject matter can then be the basis of the test.
Something like:

Kext
definition:
A zip-like directory, the windows equivalent would be a 'driver'.
Kexts are installed to /Extra/Extensions or /System/Library/Extensions (please check details prior to installation).
Prior to installation (of a kext) the kext can be tested using the kextload command. For more information on the kextload command, google 'kextload'.


Q. What is a kext?
1. A file
2. A directory
3. A program

Q. To which directory(s) should a kext be installed?
1. System/Library or System/Library/Extensions
2. System/Library/Extensions
3. Extra/Extensions or System/Extensions


Yes, this information is available from many sources but half the problem is knowing what term to google.

#8
Alessandro17

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I'm not saying shut out those that are willing to learn, maybe we should provide a knowledge base for new users where all basic info is readily available, this subject matter can then be the basis of the test.


A F.A.Q. (like the one in the Italian forum)?
I am all in favour of it. Who is going to write it?

#9
JamesLittler

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A F.A.Q. would be brilliant.

Maybe we could make it wiki format so members can contribute.
I'm sure a lot of users would be happy to do this (I would), there are quite a few people on here who actively help those new to the scene. I frequently see those people post the same replies over and over. Those users, I'm sure, would be happier to write it once and have it read a thousand times, than to write the same thing a thousand times and have each read once.

#10
Alessandro17

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It sounds feasible. Let me see what my fellow administrators think, and how it could be put into practice.

#11
JamesLittler

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It already exists:
http://wiki.osx86pro....php/Dictionary
http://wiki.osx86pro.../Knowledge_Base

Maybe these could be made more prominent and promoted to active members of the community.
I found it pretty quickly, but only because I knew what I was looking for.

#12
Alessandro17

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Those are also an option. But of course they should have more.

#13
JamesLittler

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It is a start though.
How many users here even know about these? I didn't and I've been on here pretty much every day for the last year.

Maybe it should be the first thing you see when you click 'create account', the next should be the test.

#14
Alessandro17

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It is a start though.
How many users here even know about these? I didn't and I've been on here pretty much every day for the last year.

Maybe it should be the first thing you see when you click 'create account', the next should be the test.


OK, we shall see. There are good ideas in this topic and I am sure something good will come out of them.

#15
ZØØT

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I apologize if I seemed snarky but James struck a note on this one.

I looked at the test pretty much as an "open book" test -- if my satellite ISP hadn't flaked on me I think I would have got every one of the questions right.

The wiki idea is great. Not as many people know what to look for than you would think and a FAQ comes in real handy for those who want to dig into the projects at hand.

#16
EvilMacMongo

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I think that a link when you click on create account should take you straight to the wiki, then the test, that will eliminate spam bots and lazy leechers. If you gotta read, even the simpliest directions, most people will click the next page.





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