Africa

[Swad]

Things I learned in Africa:

 

- Ubuntu is actually the name of an ancient race of people.

 

- Digital GNU is beautiful. The actual animal is ugly.

 

- Africa is a lot less like the Lion King than I thought. Tons of mountains and trees. A lot of green.

 

- The people of East Africa are some of the nicest in the world.

 

- Black babies are much cuter than white ones. Oh, and while I'm on the topic, can we please stop calling people by their skin color?

 

- The rest of the world isn't as rich as America. While poverty, poor health care, and unsafe living conditions are problems which should be fixed, western style capitalism isn't for everyone everywhere.

 

- We all take way too much for granted.

 

- There are large portions of the world's population who have never visited a doctor and never will.

Whether this is a blessing or a curse I haven't decided yet.

 

- The largest problem facing the Third World is a lack of good education.

 

- Those of us in richer nations should do absolutely everything we can to help those that are underdeveloped. Protectionism is without excuse in the face of abject poverty.

[gwprod12]

Western Style Capitalism cannot be for everyone everywhere, because it depends on lower classes of people and huge amounts of natural resources to work. The day everyone in the world becomes a capitalist is the day we start conquering other worlds ;-p

[Swad]

Western Style Capitalism cannot be for everyone everywhere, because it depends on lower classes of people and huge amounts of natural resources to work. The day everyone in the world becomes a capitalist is the day we start conquering other worlds ;-p

 

Well, capitalism in and of itself doesn't require poverty. It just so happens that corrupt governments, colonization, poor infrastructure, and a lack of natural resources have left many nations in Africa in a tough spot. It doesn't have to be that way, though. There will always be rich people and less rich people, but abject poverty doesn't have to exist.

[gwprod12]

You're right. It doesnt "have" to exist. One would think that giving people in africa a standard of living and a productivity would be in everyone's best interest. But most capitalists dont buy that. They look at their short-term interest, and there's very little short-term profit in bringing poor people up. Anywhere.

[Swad]

They look at their short-term interest, and there's very little short-term profit in bringing poor people up. Anywhere.

 

Indeed. They could actually make use of the low standard of living by moving factories there - we've seen how cheap manufacturing can do wonders for an economy, like China's. As long as the workers aren't exploited, it can really help get a nation on its feet. But that requires infrastructure, which requires a government with capital, which needs infrastructure to get that capital...

 

Interestingly enough, the best highway in Tanzania was built by the government of Japan.

[kernalzero]

Man's greed is one of the cause of many problems in Africa and the rest of the world. Greed for power and greed for wealth. Where does that get a country in the longterm? Just like gwprod12 said, it's all about short-term interests. Isn't the presence of certain natural resources fueling some of the civil unrest in Africa? Like the ivory coast. War lords fighting for resources to control the region. I don't claim to know what it's like Africa, I haven't been (hope to go to world cup 2010 in S. Africa). That's just what I perceive from western news (CNN and BBC). Do you have any deeper perspective to this Mash, having been there?

[johnniecarcinogen]

- The rest of the world isn't as rich as America. While poverty, poor health care, and unsafe living conditions are problems which should be fixed, western style capitalism isn't for everyone everywhere.

 

- We all take way too much for granted.

 

- There are large portions of the world's population who have never visited a doctor and never will.

Whether this is a blessing or a curse I haven't decided yet.

 

- The largest problem facing the Third World is a lack of good education.

 

- Those of us in richer nations should do absolutely everything we can to help those that are underdeveloped. Protectionism is without excuse in the face of abject poverty.

 

Even before capitalism the people of Africa were living in what we call 'poverty'. But what exactly is poverty? If you have never had or have seen something do you desire it, and if you do not desire something which you don't have do you not then suffer less?

 

Should they get an education that we in the western world deem fit that will make them learn our ideals and 'standards'?

 

Poverty may not neccesarily be 'poverty' when measured by different criteria.

[gwprod12]

Greed, is Good. If channeled productively. Obviously it's easier to rob a bank than to invent a product (actually, it's not easier, but it seems easier), Obviously it's easier to stripmine Saudi Arabia for oil than it is to invent alternative sources.

 

If the playing field called for doing anything to advance greed, as long as it was 1) good for the environment, 2) good for workers and 3) good for consumers, we'd live in a much different place.

 

Actually, here we have a problem. Consumers are, by definition, those who consume. In the united states and other western nations, a Consumer is someone who consumes more than their fairshare, and in the case of the united states, a Consumer is someone who not only consumes more than their fair share, but consumes more than they produce. Ideally, I would produce something that has little value for me to consume, and I would trade it to you for something you have that you dont need, but that I do.

The united states is quickly making itself obselete by warring to acquire materials to keep the people happy.

 

The United States spends more money than it takes in. For any of you with huge credit card debts, you know that it doesnt last forever.

[kernalzero]

Greed: a desire to obtain more money, wealth, material possessions or any other entity than one needs.

 

Ambition: motivation, especially to improve a situation.

(the definitions are from wikipedia.com)

 

I'm not trying to play the semantics game but there is a difference.

 

I do understand what you're saying though. We are out pacing our resources but not adequately preparing for when they run out at the same time(obviously oil and fossil fuels). Rather than research new technology at an appropriate rate, we're strategically positioning ourselves in oil rich regions in the hopes they will provide us with some of whats left under the soil. It's a very short sighted approach to an issue that should be tackled for the longterm. This is driven by greed. Ambiotion would be to improve this situation by researching new technologies. You can use that same concept for food production, health care, education and programs like social security.

 

how do you provide these sort of things for a global population that is expected to grow from ~6billion today to >8billion by 2035 with a short sighted approach to problem solving?? We can't, it's that simple. Some smaller countries are trying to promote better ways of doing things but until closed minded, $$ driven , opinion motivated, politicians (rather than trying to stay objective) in large economy countries start to help, nothing will change until we're too late and scrambling for a solution.