Redliner Posted May 2, 2009 Share Posted May 2, 2009 I am a long time hackintosh user, a contributing member on the OS X86 forums... and an avid ebayer. I decided to sell my acer aspire one to help pay some late bills, after all... the new netbooks will be out soon. The sale ended yesterday and the buyer payed in full via paypal. this morning i wake up, check my email, and find out that the item has been removed, that i cannot contact the buyer to verify if he still wants it... and that his paypal information doesn't match up to any phone records, neither does his name. Ebay's site has blocked me from contacting that user completely, therefore i cannot request the user's phone # online. I've sent him emails via multiple accounts... everything returns saying the email can't be reached. While discussing this with the Ebay rep. he told me that apple had sent ebay "Signed & photocopied Legal Documents" which require ebay to remove the listing by law. I asked him if he could give me the email, a name, a phone number to those bringing the charge against me. He was not able. I asked him whom my lawyer could contact to see the "documents" he said that was not allowed. By US law: i have the right to see the documents. I asked him for contact information to ebay's legal dept. he refused... ackowledged that there was a legal dept. and that he had the contact information. So i asked him who my lawyer could contact at ebay... and he said that "my lawyer would know". so let me get this straight: my account was suspended, item removed (after the sale had closed), and i was blocked from communicating with the buyer. and I'm not allowed to exercise my right to see said documents???? I'm not alowed to contact the legal dept??? I have the right to represent myself. and the kicker: all because apple is a power tripping, controlling company. The only thing apple cold do is to not "support" the hardware. that is what their EULA is for. The EULA is clearly designed to PROTECT APPLE... NOT TO CONTROL THE END USER. And why the :censored2: didn't apple CONTACT ME??????? I WANT MY EBAY ACCOUNT BACK! /RANT CALL ME YOU :censored2: APPLE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c0rk007hck Posted May 2, 2009 Share Posted May 2, 2009 Can you return his money back? If he has payed via paypal, you can get his email address in your profile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konami® Posted May 2, 2009 Share Posted May 2, 2009 Oh my god, are you serious? I never thought Apple was like that, why Apple did all these things to your account? I don't understand well... :censored2: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redliner Posted May 2, 2009 Author Share Posted May 2, 2009 i tried to contact him via email, i kept getting a failed to reach contact return message. i am just waiting for him to contact me now... since his paypal info is outdated... i dont even know where to send the thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abscheele Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 were you selling the laptop with osx on it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stroke Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 As I said previously before it was deleted: you're retarded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AppleIIGuy Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Dude if you sell a non Apple laptop with os x on it, your just like psystar and your gonna get in trouble Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redliner Posted May 3, 2009 Author Share Posted May 3, 2009 stroke, i saw the other post via email... yes, i'm not the brightest... but i still believe i have the right to do what i want with the operating system. I wasn't including the OS install disc or even my purchased retail copy (my family has multiple macs... we bought the fam. pack to upgrade) however, what i do with osx is my business. again, the EULA is to protect the company, not to control the end user. It's not like I was charging a premium for it, and if anything i got less money because osx was installed... so it's not like i made some crazy margin cause of the os. (I got $250 for acer aspire one 120gig hd 1 gig ram Dell 1505 wireless external usb drive... cost me $390 total with shipping) In my eyes, psystar is different, a commercial company needs to work out commercial plans for licensing the OS... especially if psystar is going to claim to support their hardware. idc... it runs mac, apple isn't responsible to support it... but they can't manipulate me, my account, or what i do with it. that's against my rights. and as far as ebay goes, if i request the legal documents that supposedly were signed by some judge or whomever... i have the right to see them. And don't tell me you can't give me information to your freaking legal dept... that's wack. rough analogy: it's one thing for me to swap a honda motor into a ford... and sell it on ebay/craigslist... but it's entireley differnt for me to start a car company and buy fords, and swap jdm engines in them and resell them... that, ford could have a problem with, lol. and please don't read into it too much... or try to get all rhetorical. again, acording to the ebay rep apple cited me breaking the EULA, that's what im discusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konami® Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 I understand your point, but dude, you can't sell a PC with OS X installed. It is really unethical. What you could probably do, was to sell the PC without OS and include original OS X disks. That perhaps could be legal in Apple eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lostgame Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 I think OSx86 is like smoking weed. It's not legal but since so many people think it is they're willing to do stupid things with it and then complain when they get in trouble. I mean honestly - what do you expect? You play ball, expect there to be a chance you'll lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vbetts Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 If you're trying to sell the aspire with osx86 on it, that's something you can't do. What you can do is, sell the aspire, saying it can run osx86. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farchord Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Yeah, I agree with the past posters. Selling a laptop when blatantly stating that you have OSX86 running on it is kind of a recipe for trouble. It's stated in the EULA that you are not owning a copy of the software, but just a right to use the software depending on if you respect their terms. So yeah, that was kind of a bad move on your part Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAppleFreak Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Seriously, that is stupid. You should have erased the HD with the 35-pass 0-write out and then sell it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSmokingBandit Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 I understand your point, but dude, you can't sell a PC with OS X installed. It is really unethical. What you could probably do, was to sell the PC without OS and include original OS X disks. That perhaps could be legal in Apple eyes. Legal in Apple's eyes doesnt mean {censored}. They dont make the laws. Apple is just scared because people are getting a better deal than they offer and the more people realize that apple's hardware is nothing special and osx works well on other hardware the less people are going to pay the exorbitant prices. I would fight this, OP. Call ebay and ask to talk to the manager or whoever is in charge around there. Dont waste your time with whoever answers your call. Selling a computer with osx on it is not illegal. It violates the EULA, but the EULA is not the law. You should not have had your listing removed and i would make a big fuss about it. If nothing else you will waste alot of the managers time and {censored} him/her of as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGJulius Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 You shouldn't be selling a laptop with OS X running illegally on it; however, you do have the right to contact the Apple legal team and demand the charge brought against you and the evidence pertaining to the charge, but that's as far as I would go. BTW don't sell laptop running OS X if its not a mac, just dumb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redliner Posted May 3, 2009 Author Share Posted May 3, 2009 I worked in a call center for over a year. I tried everything i could, ebay straight refuses to transfer you. refuses to give you info... they are however very well trained and very polite... and it's not the managers it's the legal dept that i want to talk to. as far as apple goes: WTF didn't they call me!?!!!?! apple, where are your balls? apparent;y you used them up on psystar??!?? big companies with big monies are scared of big lawsuits... so they bend the rules to save them money. well not if it infringes on my rights. I requested the legal dept. they refuse me the info... i request someone from apple to contact... they decline that they have such info... then WHO THE HECK signed LEGAL DOCUMENTS AGAINST ME?!!!?!? WTF. so sure, i shouldn't have sold it on ebay... it's a a thin line... apple is a bunch insecure of control freaks... and what not... but wtf. OMG i sold something that apple doesn't like. whhooppdeeedoo... send me the cease and desist order!?!!!? don't use ebay as your F@#@(#@ mouth piece, apple. at this point i doubt i will ever buy a real mac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pontifex22 Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Well I agree that it is "sort of unfair" what eBay did. And surly I also would be pisssed and swear not ever to buy a real Mac. But why did you not sell OS X seperate from the notebook? Why take a chance? We all here know we are in the legally gray area (depending where you live) So why take a chance? All very unfortunate the way it went... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
telir Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Very disparate by apple. Hope you come out ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vbetts Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Legal in Apple's eyes doesnt mean {censored}. They dont make the laws.Apple is just scared because people are getting a better deal than they offer and the more people realize that apple's hardware is nothing special and osx works well on other hardware the less people are going to pay the exorbitant prices. I would fight this, OP. Call ebay and ask to talk to the manager or whoever is in charge around there. Dont waste your time with whoever answers your call. Selling a computer with osx on it is not illegal. It violates the EULA, but the EULA is not the law. You should not have had your listing removed and i would make a big fuss about it. If nothing else you will waste alot of the managers time and {censored} him/her of as well. Wow, you're dumb. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EULA You don't own the product. When you buy Mac, you license the product out. It is illegal, since you are selling a version of their OS on a computer not manufactured by them. If it were your company, and your OS, you'd do the same. There's nothing to defend this guy with. He did something that has been told over and over and over not to do, but still did it. There are topics all over this site saying that osx86 is illegal. EULA is something you agree to when you use the product. If you aren't following it, you're breaking contract, which is illegal. Apple didn't make any laws, but they're following them. It's not being a control freak wanting your product not to be over used and everything like that. Now, I agree that Apple did kind of go a little bit out there just to stop you from selling it, but you got what you deserved for it. In a very {censored} way though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redliner Posted May 3, 2009 Author Share Posted May 3, 2009 buyer contacted me via phone today. He's still going to get it. after all he already payed... F#*& you apple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konami® Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 F#*& you apple. Ignorance at his best Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redliner Posted May 3, 2009 Author Share Posted May 3, 2009 yupp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vbetts Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 F#*& you apple. Apple is not doing anything wrong!!! Like I said, what they did was a little extreme, but that's Ebays part too right there. Apple is doing what they need to do to protect their product! You're the one expecting to sell a netbook with an illegal os on a public trading site that has many rules and laws to follow, with no problem. It's your own fault this happened, you have no right to be angry at Apple, be angry at yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pontifex22 Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 you have no right to be angry at Apple, be angry at yourself. Oh - now emotions are becomming part of legality and obedience. Just leave it here, enough said on all that matters on this case... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vbetts Posted May 4, 2009 Share Posted May 4, 2009 Oh - now emotions are becomming part of legality and obedience. Just leave it here, enough said on all that matters on this case... It's not really concerned with emotions, it's just that he has no argument to make against it. It's like an opium dealer wonder why he's bubbas buddy in jail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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